# What I use to shoot short arrows



## sabaca

Shooting short arrows is difficult because usually don't fly straight, with this design at last i have solved all the problems, the secret is how to release the tail.










It's better to use a threaded rod so one can fine tune the position of butterfly nut and try what works best and to use a sphere instead of a nut on the tail, it give the best release, a squared nut doesn't work

then clean with some alcohol the rod and glue everything together, it's easy to build and cheap.



This was my first attempt, this arrow go wrong because of pressure applied only on one side and not in the center position and because of sharp edges of the grip zone on the tail



Instead of leather you have to use some paracord and build a pouch like this one.



If you're afraid to pierce your hand you can use a slingshot like Bill Herriman Shooting Star that protects the entire forearm, but in my opinion there is no need

Instead of duch tape you can use normal arrow feathers.

Bye and have a nice day.


----------



## NightKnight

That's a brilliant solution for shooting fletchettes! Bravo!


----------



## lucifer93

I love your small arrow designs, great work and thanks for posting the photos


----------



## A+ Slingshots

with Aaron!! Nice work!! Should be fun to mess about with!!!


----------



## abwurfgrenni

that looks good, i like that design (because i use something similar







), thx for the pics


----------



## boyntonstu

If one of those ever hit you, you would be screwed!


----------



## PandaMan

That's cool, I might try that. What's the ball on the end for? Is it necessary?


----------



## sabaca

> That's cool, I might try that. What's the ball on the end for? Is it necessary?


Yes, for a good grip is really necessary, if you find plastic balls is even better wooden ones tend to split

Another tip I give you is not shorten the arrow, this afternoon i have tried a 12cm version and and does not work.

They are very dangerous i think they can be used to hunt big game.


----------



## A+ Slingshots

sabaca said:


> That's cool, I might try that. What's the ball on the end for? Is it necessary?
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, for a good grip is really necessary, if you find plastic balls is even better wooden ones tend to split
> 
> Another tip I give you is not shorten the arrow, this afternoon i have tried a 12cm version and not works.
> 
> They are very dangerous i think they can be used to hunt big game.
Click to expand...

Try coating your wooden beads with "Super Glue" it hardens and strengths them quite a bit. No more splits! That's how we do it on our "EZ" Take Down Slingshot Arrows here a A+.


----------



## zille

Just had to try these, the thing is simple and fast built. For shooting I wore my ballistic safety glasses...

They work great...went easily through everything in its way. I'd use a slingshot with a little space between the forks for starters, I had a fork hit and damaged my poor phoenix.

It's fun but it should be handled carefully.


----------



## sabaca

Well done, but use a slingshot with a taller fork, penetrates the wood like butter i want to build a shield with a little wooden board under the fork for safety.


----------



## zille

second that...for these babies you need steel and a wide fork...your big game theory isn't far from truth in my opinion...I used trainingbands and still bamm!


----------



## Deimos

this looks deadly, nice


----------



## JoergS

This is brilliant!

I think these projectiles are ideally suited for one of my sling-x-bows as there is no danger for your hands.

Sabaca, would you be OK with me using your flechette design in one of my next projects on The Slingshot Channel? I would give you full credits of course.

Jörg


----------



## dgui

very nice.


----------



## Hrawk

To repeat what Joerg said, Simply Brilliant!!!

When the zombies finally come (and they will) I'm heading straight for the hardware store!


----------



## JoergS

Hrawk said:


> When the zombies finally come (and they will) I'm heading straight for the hardware store!


Had to buy some salt for my drive this morning, and picked up the parts for flechettes like this one, both M6 and M8.

I will use a hex nut instead of the wood ball, but I will shoot the flechettes from a specifically designed sling-X-bow.

Jörg


----------



## sabaca

> Sabaca, would you be OK with me using your flechette design in one of my next projects on The Slingshot Channel? I would give you full credits of course.


No problems, I'm curious how you will use this flechette I can not wait...


----------



## Hrawk

JoergS said:


> I will use a hex nut instead of the wood ball, but I will shoot the flechettes from a specifically designed sling-X-bow.
> 
> Jörg


Do you think the hex nut will be ok going through the paracord loop ?

You scare me man, I can see it catching and coming right back at you


----------



## JoergS

Hrawk said:


> Do you think the hex nut will be ok going through the paracord loop ?
> 
> You scare me man, I can see it catching and coming right back at you


I will round the hex nut well enough. And of course I will fire it from a safe position, "Mythbuster" style - no problem with a trigger operated weapon.


----------



## HOE

Awesome design, how many shots have you done with this setup? Is its accuracy good?


----------



## PandaMan

Actually, that brings up a point, Jörg. I haven't bought any of the components yet, but how much does it matter what thickness it is? I though M6 would be suitable, but might that be a bit heavy?


----------



## 919h

I'm impressed and very interested in your idea.
This shows again the large possibility that may have a slingshot.
A slingshot can shot everything !

How heavy is the arrow ? I am tempted to make them lighter.

Thank you for your sharing.

Xavier


----------



## zille

it's about 25 gram...looks heavier







. I think the weight adds to its destruction power. The thing easily penetrates wood and is quite exactly aiming-wise.


----------



## PandaMan

Ok, good. I'll let you know if I cripple my hands later on







. I won't, though.
But Zille, what screw did you use? Or was it just a threaded rod? What diameter, etc?


----------



## JoergS

I think that M8 probably works better than M6, the additional weight will increase the energy. But I will try both.

Threaded rods are very inexpensive, bought them for 1,50 Euro a piece (1 Meter). I can make six darts from each one. So I will have 18 M6 and 18 M8 versions. Add the hex nut and the wingnut and we are talking under 40 cents for a dart.

Jörg


----------



## PandaMan

Really? Looking online, it's stupid prices. Saw some for about £20 per meter!
But what bands should I use with these if I'm using M8?


----------



## sabaca

With 8mm diameter rod Joerg  is to build  a sort of crossbow, 8mm darts are heavy !


----------



## JoergS

PandaMan said:


> Really? Looking online, it's stupid prices. Saw some for about £20 per meter!
> But what bands should I use with these if I'm using M8?


Here's 10 of them for 9 quid.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/PACK-10-M8-THREADED-BAR-ROD-1-METRE-LENGTHS-/190431377500?pt=UK_DIY_Material_Nails_Fixing_MJ&hash=item2c5698385c

Jörg


----------



## JoergS

sabaca said:


> With 8mm diameter rod Joerg is to build a sort of crossbow, 8mm darts are heavy !


Yes, a rubber powered crossbow. I will use heavy Thera Band Gold Bands, 2,5 times the strength of Fish Hunterbands. That should send the dart flying at 65 to 70 m/s. It will be devastating.

This could well be the new king of badass. 

Jörg


----------



## PandaMan

I think I'm going to use 5mm, because according to my calculations, that's the width that you used, Sabaca. Am I right?


----------



## JoergS

PandaMan said:


> I think I'm going to use 5mm, because according to my calculations, that's the width that you used, Sabaca. Am I right?


I think Sabaca used 6mm.


----------



## zille

I think it's 6...really works fine, don't mind the weight...you've seen Jörg shoot way heavier bullets than that and killing all kinds of targets.


----------



## HOE

JoergS said:


> With 8mm diameter rod Joerg is to build a sort of crossbow, 8mm darts are heavy !


Yes, a rubber powered crossbow. I will use heavy Thera Band Gold Bands, 2,5 times the strength of Fish Hunterbands. That should send the dart flying at 65 to 70 m/s. It will be devastating.

This could well be the new king of badass. 

Jörg
[/quote]

I can't wait to see your video shooting this thing.


----------



## PandaMan

My bad. I went out and bought some M6 rod and M6 wing nuts (butterfly nuts, whatever). Now what do I use to cut it to length and sharpen it?


----------



## zille

i used my jigsaw with a saw blade for metal. 10 seconds and the rod was cut...for the tip I just used my file and some patience.


----------



## sabaca

> Now what do I use to cut it to length and sharpen it?


For mass replicating you need an Angle Grinder or grindstone to sharpen the tip, otherwise you have to work a lot,

a jigsaw is the right tool to cut a rod.

A set of darts in a glasses case ready to shot.


----------



## JoergS

I use my angle grinder both for cutting and shaping the rods.


----------



## PandaMan

I don't have either of those. I just made one using a junior hacksaw and some filing. It was totally worth it. I test fired it at a wooden box and it went inside! The whole thing made it through the first side of the wooden box. And also, I couldn't find any strong string to make the loop, so I used duct tape instead. I was using double TB black semi-butterfly.


----------



## 919h

threaded rod weight 1 meter
Diameter
3 > 44gr
4 > 78gr
5 > 124gr
6 > 177gr
8 > 319gr

Butterfly nut
Diameter
3 > 2gr
4 > 3.4gr
5 > 4 gr
6 > 8gr
8 > 9gr


----------



## PandaMan

919h said:


> threaded rod weight 1 meter
> Diameter
> 3 > 44gr
> 4 > 78gr
> 5 > 124gr
> 6 > 177gr
> 8 > 319gr
> 
> ear weight nut
> Diameter
> 3 > 2gr
> 4 > 3.4gr
> 5 > 4 gr
> 6 > 8gr
> 8 > 9gr


Wow. That means my flechettes are 36.32 grams(560.502 grains)!
















I'll be having fun with these!


----------



## JoergS

This means the M8 one weighs as much as the bonecrushers! And the M6 one weighs as much as a 19 mm (.75") lead ball.

Jörg


----------



## BCLuxor

Somebody has got to post a shooting video of these darts I am considering whipping some up but I don't want to waste my energy half assing them if I dont like how they fly.. But the "pro" made ones look very cool.


----------



## Ryan

Nice!


----------



## JoergS

I am thinking about replacing the single paracord loop with two smaller loops at the end of each band side. The two bands would not be connected by a "pouch".

Advantage: Less danger of potential entanglements (fletching and "knob").


----------



## PandaMan

Ok, Jörg. Let us know how that goes then. I'm interested in whether that works or not, because one of my flechettes got tangled in the loop and hit my lower arm. Luckily, it wasn't the sharp bit!


----------



## HOE

JoergS said:


> I am thinking about replacing the single paracord loop with two smaller loops at the end of each band side. The two bands would not be connected by a "pouch".
> 
> Advantage: Less danger of potential entanglements (fletching and "knob").


This is awesome man! This looks safer.


----------



## 919h

It's great !
These darts are perfectly suited to the ammo slingshot.
Development opportunities are enormous !


----------



## PandaMan

after some alterations, I'm finding the single loop to be safe enough. Two loops would make it take slightly longer to reload.
I've just changed to different bands. I don't know what rubber it is, but it's awesome. It has a really low draw weight and I shoot butterfly with it using these flechettes. Dan sent me this rubber, so I'll ask him what it is.


----------



## CB900SS

You guys are insane! I can't wait for the video!!


----------



## 919h

CB900SS said:


> You guys are insane! I can't wait for the video!!


Does your name means Honda 900cbr, or cb hornet 900/919 ?

It's just out of curiosity.

Xav


----------



## Brooklyn00003

wrong post , cant delete


----------



## slingor

JoergS said:


> This means the M8 one weighs as much as the bonecrushers! And the M6 one weighs as much as a 19 mm (.75") lead ball.
> 
> Jörg


Gruessgott Joerg,
first things first my compliments to my fellow countryman Sabaca who remains the intellectual owner of this deadly simple suggestion. 
Then, since you love fidgeting (how skillfully!) with lathes, mills, stainless steel welding and the likes, why not use a straight rod, replace the ear nut with a hole in the same position plus a tinier rod forced through the hole (secured with a hint of welding if need be) and bent backward to be able to engage the "pouch"?
As a final touch I'd dispose of the nut or the ball and would file instead two opposite concave grooves at the end of the rod so as to pull it with that beautiful mechanical release of yours (that I still can't get to replicate).
I concede it is more complicated than Sabaca's original idea, yet a plain rod with minimal encumbrances would fly better than a threaded one with an heavier ear nut and an additional weight at the back.
Another pulling variation could be drilling a hole as back as possible, attach a paracord string loop and draw back with the index or with a bow mechanical release.
Why don't I try to implement this Ideas myself and duly post the results?
Here in Rome I lack the necessary equipment as well as a suitable work space.
Letztens bin ich ja keiner Joerg Sprave.


----------



## sabaca

> As a final touch I'd dispose of the nut or the ball and would file instead two opposite concave grooves at the end of the rod


Slingor I tried your solution in my first attempt, the picture with the arrow with red flaps, but a ball gives the best release of the projectile in my opinion.

A better arrow should have this form in one piece, but i I do not know how to work the metal


----------



## slingor

sabaca said:


> As a final touch I'd dispose of the nut or the ball and would file instead two opposite concave grooves at the end of the rod
> 
> 
> 
> Slingor I tried your solution in my first attempt, the picture with the arrow with red flaps, but a ball gives the best release of the projectile in my opinion.
> 
> A better arrow should have this form in one piece, but i I do not know how to work the metal
Click to expand...

Uncontested, your solution is simple, unexpensive, and, last but not least, effective, even certified by Joerg's video.
My suggestions are only untested improvement attempts (copying is reportedly easier than inventing), the aim of which is to eliminate threading and accessories in order to increase the dart performance.
The last one you quoted (grooves instead of nut or ball) was only meant for use in connection with Joerg's mechanical release for slingshots (the metal one, if you have seen it).
I suppose I'd better try to make a couple of prototypes and post them, maybe using wooden rods, since in Rome I only have got less than basic equipment for metal working.
Going one step off topic: you are Italian too, I've read your posts on avventurosamente.it. Where you from exacltly? You are not Abruzzese, are you? We should further discuss the shepherd dogs approach, I mean the big white ones with nailed iron collars.
Anyway, compliments for your ideas (not only the flechettes, of course) and for your English, for as much as a non-native speaker's compliment might be worth.


----------



## slingor

I managed to do some prototyping during the lunch pause. It took me 20 minutes to organize a gross demo. No video unfortunately and poor quality pictures due to poor equipment (low resolution palmtop).
However it gives a hint of my approach to Sabaca's basics.

Aim setting: build a dart Sabaca-style without threaded rod and back nut or ball, optimized for Joerg's mechanical release.

List of materials:
1 plastic clamp to act a slingshot fork
1 plastic clamp to play the role of mechanical release
2 sets of 4 pieces common office bands tied 2 -1-1 to make the bands
1 segment of big size attach to play the butterfly screw
1 chinese chopstick as the dart (25 cm approx)

target: hardpaper box, dimensions A4
distance from target: 4 metres
attempts: 5
successful hits 5
penetration: 10 to 15 cm.
best results: using the makeshift release.
Owing to speed reasons I left the bands end loose, therefore no pouch, nevertheless it seemed to work fine.
I confess I can't wait to see how a steel rod would perform.
I hope to come back with a more professional presentation soon.
Suggestions and comments are most welcome, especially those highlighting the weak points of the project.
Lastly, the grooves, or maybe the dents at the back of the dart foresee a release of some sort, however threading the back tip could allow all 3 approaches:
free hand mechanical release, Sabaca's original idea and Joergs exaggerated performance with nut to be used withy his new sling x bow for flechettes.
Hope I didn't bore you too much.

pictures below:


----------



## Tex-Shooter

Am I missing something! Why even use a threaded rod, just use a steel or aluminum rod and grind a notch near the tip like Blair's short arrows. Then use the tape for fletching. The notch near the tip has been used for a long time, at least 40 years. 
http://www.combowslingguy.com/


----------



## sabaca

> Going one step off topic: you are Italian too, I've read your posts on avventurosamente.it. Where you from exacltly? You are not Abruzzese, are you? We should further discuss the shepherd dogs approach, I mean the big white ones with nailed iron collars.
> Anyway, compliments for your ideas (not only the flechettes, of course) and for your English, for as much as a non-native speaker's compliment might be worth.


Slingor thank you very much, i am happy to see here a friend from Avventurosamente.it, i am of Marche, i write with the help of Google translator it does a good job better then microsoft Bing, my english is only at school level.

I I carry with me the slingshot while hiking out to shoot firecrackers to scare the shepherd dogs.

I have learned a lot about slingshots on this forum, if you're interested I can share with you some beautiful design and tips.

See you on Avventurosamente.


----------



## slingor

Tex-Shooter said:


> Am I missing something! Why even use a threaded rod, just use a steel or aluminum rod and grind a notch near the tip like Blair's short arrows. Then use the tape for fletching. The notch near the tip has been used for a long time, at least 40 years.
> http://www.combowslingguy.com/


Tex I thank you very much for the link, I was delighted. Those at the back of Blair's flechettes are exactly the concavities I had in mind, my apologies to the producer for forwarding an already consolidated concept, it happens to newbies. That confirms me in the conviction that, very likely, whatever one thinks has already been made, maybe better than one's own idea. No reason to stop brainworking, however.
The threaded rod approach has got some plusses, anyway. It is possible to prepare the darts in minutes, most of the time being taken for sharpening. Further, it might be fine for prototyping: the butterfly nut grants calibration tests, no welding, no drilling, no milling, just a saw and a file for steelworking, then once a satisfying base model has been made there is ample room for variations.


----------



## slingor

sabaca said:


> Going one step off topic: you are Italian too, I've read your posts on avventurosamente.it. Where you from exacltly? You are not Abruzzese, are you? We should further discuss the shepherd dogs approach, I mean the big white ones with nailed iron collars.
> Anyway, compliments for your ideas (not only the flechettes, of course) and for your English, for as much as a non-native speaker's compliment might be worth.
> 
> 
> 
> Slingor thank you very much, i am happy to see here a friend from Avventurosamente.it, i am of Marche, i write with the help of Google translator it does a good job better then microsoft Bing, my english is only at school level.
> 
> I I carry with me the slingshot while hiking out to shoot firecrackers to scare the shepherd dogs.
> 
> I have learned a lot about slingshots on this forum, if you're interested I can share with you some beautiful design and tips.
> 
> See you on Avventurosamente.
Click to expand...

Actually I'm no member of Avventurosamente, not yet. I'll join in a very short time. Linguistically speaking, it's awesome that a freeware translator could work that fine. This man-machine interaction deserves more attention.
As for dogs and firecrackers I ask you the same question a shepherd in the Abruzzi asked me on this matter (my issue was carrying a blank shot handgun) "what are you going to do if you meet a DEAF dog?"
Recently I started carrying a black bands Trumark F1 and heavy ammos, even though I never shoot lead or steel outdoor, only stones. I will add some of your darts, given their simplicity, as well as some of mine (so to say), if I ever manage to implement Joerg Sprave's mechanical release. The fact is that I no longer have a firm hold on the pouch, due to a wrist bone alteration.
See you, and keep churning ideas.


----------



## HOE

slingor said:


> Am I missing something! Why even use a threaded rod, just use a steel or aluminum rod and grind a notch near the tip like Blair's short arrows. Then use the tape for fletching. The notch near the tip has been used for a long time, at least 40 years.
> http://www.combowslingguy.com/


Tex I thank you very much for the link, I was delighted. Those at the back of Blair's flechettes are exactly the concavities I had in mind, my apologies to the producer for forwarding an already consolidated concept, it happens to newbies. That confirms me in the conviction that, very likely, whatever one thinks has already been made, maybe better than one's own idea. No reason to stop brainworking, however.
The threaded rod approach has got some plusses, anyway. It is possible to prepare the darts in minutes, most of the time being taken for sharpening. Further, it might be fine for prototyping: the butterfly nut grants calibration tests, no welding, no drilling, no milling, just a saw and a file for steelworking, then once a satisfying base model has been made there is ample room for variations.
[/quote]

About sharpening the rods, maybe you can use a propane torch and heat the tip red hot, then hammer it as flat as you prefer. After that, use a steel rod cutter and snip off both edges diagonally, then file it sharp.

I use this method for sharpening my mini arrows heads which are made from steel wire, instead of mindlessly grinding with a file.The result will be a spearhead tip.


----------



## slingor

HOE said:


> Am I missing something! Why even use a threaded rod, just use a steel or aluminum rod and grind a notch near the tip like Blair's short arrows. Then use the tape for fletching. The notch near the tip has been used for a long time, at least 40 years.
> http://www.combowslingguy.com/


Tex I thank you very much for the link, I was delighted. Those at the back of Blair's flechettes are exactly the concavities I had in mind, my apologies to the producer for forwarding an already consolidated concept, it happens to newbies. That confirms me in the conviction that, very likely, whatever one thinks has already been made, maybe better than one's own idea. No reason to stop brainworking, however.
The threaded rod approach has got some plusses, anyway. It is possible to prepare the darts in minutes, most of the time being taken for sharpening. Further, it might be fine for prototyping: the butterfly nut grants calibration tests, no welding, no drilling, no milling, just a saw and a file for steelworking, then once a satisfying base model has been made there is ample room for variations.
[/quote]

About sharpening the rods, maybe you can use a propane torch and heat the tip red hot, then hammer it as flat as you prefer. After that, use a steel rod cutter and snip off both edges diagonally, then file it sharp.

I use this method for sharpening my mini arrows heads which are made from steel wire, instead of mindlessly grinding with a file.The result will be a spearhead tip.
[/quote]

Thanks for the hint, but what you say belongs canonical steel working (roughly what I do in my native village, where I've got work space and all sort of equipment), whereas the point I wanted to highlight was simply that, even here in Rome I could make Sabaca's darts using poor equipment. The question is: apart from the satisfaction to build something that stirred my interest, what the **ll do I need those darts for here in Rome? Even though law restrictions on slingshots aren't that strict here in Italy (but I'm checking with a police friend), I might possibly be accused of illegal weapon production, still I could lazy around with a heavy butcher's knife because "I need it to chop steaks". 
Bye


----------



## slingor

HOE, on Today, 12:09 PM, said:
[/quote]
I use this method for sharpening my mini arrows heads which are made from steel wire, instead of mindlessly grinding with a file.The result will be a spearhead tip.
[/quote]

Beg you pardon, what do you shoot your mini arrows with? Could you post any pictures?
Thanks

ps
I'm afraid I messed up something with the reply form. I humbly apologize.


----------



## HOE

The sketch.








The Trigger, made of steel wire.









http://img828.images...8/speargun1.png
http://img148.images...0/speargun2.png
http://img139.images...4/speargun3.png

It's made of bamboo, actually I've even forgotten how I cut the slot for the trigger and the arrow channel! I don't have the arrow anymore because I only had one and it broke from repeated shots and the arrow head flew out to the roof. I can see it rusting there.

I was inspired by this. http://www.africanarcher.com/survivor/art_pipegun.htm


----------



## slingor

HOE said:


> The sketch.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Trigger, made of steel wire.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://img828.images...8/speargun1.png
> http://img148.images...0/speargun2.png
> http://img139.images...4/speargun3.png
> 
> It's made of bamboo, actually I've even forgotten how I cut the slot for the trigger and the arrow channel! I don't have the arrow anymore because I only had one and it broke from repeated shots and the arrow head flew out to the roof. I can see it rusting there.
> 
> I was inspired by this. http://www.africanar...art_pipegun.htm


Amazing! So disarmingly simple! Thank you very much for sharing.
I suppose you tested it. What about performances, such as reach, penetration, speed, field experiences?


----------



## HOE

The accuracy is not good because the arrow is not fletched, just weighted tip for flight stabilization. Power and penetration is good for it's size and weight, the arrow head penetrated a 1cm thick soft wood board at 5 metres, that power is comparable with my steel blowgun dart at the same range.

As for range, I never really tested it, but at 10 metres, the arrow flew completely straight, very flat trajectory. I wanted to make the arrows out of aluminium tubings, but never made it.

What I suggest you is to make one out of a large piece of bamboo if you want some serious power. I use bamboo because it's easy to shape and cut the slot for the trigger. A hobby saw, a knife, a set of small carving chisels and a hand drill are all you need to make it. At the front of the bamboo, you drill a hole which is just big enough for the arrow to pass through. The knot section of the bamboo will act as the arrow rest, it's really simple! But I don't have access to a large piece of quality bamboo.

It's tested and it's absolutely safe to use. Just wear goggles because the risk is the same as slingshots. You can just use broken slingshot bands to power it.


The arrow channel has to be parallel with the arrow rest.

Edit: More detailed pictures.
http://img638.imageshack.us/img638/9528/speargunarrowchannel.png
http://img706.imageshack.us/img706/3315/speargunfrontview.png
http://img149.imageshack.us/img149/3476/spearguntriggerbottom.png
http://img408.imageshack.us/img408/8639/spearguntrigger.png


----------



## Tex-Shooter

There you go using your brain again Hoe! Nice job!

I like the idea of forming a flat tip. We used to make frog gigs that way (filing a point and a barb!)

If I am making a fletchette with an aluminum rod I file the notch with a chainsaw file and finish with a flat file. It cuts the aluminum very quickly. If made out of steel I get a hack saw into the process to speed it up and make a place for the chainsaw file to start. -- Tex-Shooter


----------



## slingor

Excellent Hoe! Both drawings and pictures. If it is difficult to find a suitable cut of bamboo for you (I'm assuming you're writing from Malaysia), just imagine if it isn't for me in Rome. Were it matter of bricks and marbor I'd be luckier, we've got plenty! Just imagine shooting game using Colosseum rubble, or leftovers of Michelangelo's sculptures, true historical hunting. 
However I've got a length of aluminium pipe that could do the job and some teflon scraps to replicate the bamboo knots.
The project is so facinating simple that deserves a try.
Off topic questions:
is this weapon common to your area, or it's just an idea you picked up and developped on your own?
If positive, is it still used, and how effectively, to take down small game or for other purposes?

I'm most grateful to you for this interesting exchange.


----------



## HOE

Actually, it was developed by myself out of desperation. Taking ideas from here and there, and it works! It sucks that I don't know where I can buy those bamboo for artworks.

Another concept for the arrow rest and power band is from here.
http://www.coconutstudio.com/Fishing%20Methods%201%20Pana.htm

The arrowhead idea comes from this. I think tiny copper tubes can be used instead.
http://web.archive.org/web/20050518054319/www.geezers-corner.com/GeezersCorner/tubepointx.html

I've never used it for hunting, but I believe a larger one with heavier arrow with a big broadhead can kill any small games easily, the only concern is the accuracy. I've thought of making one out of thick PVC pipe, using a PVC cap to replicate the bamboo knot for the arrow channel and epoxy something for the arrow rest. But I don't think I can make it precisely using only a coping saw, it's not easy to shape. I've to consider that! Whatever works!


----------



## slingor

HOE said:


> Actually, it was developed by myself out of desperation. Taking ideas from here and there, and it works! It sucks that I don't know where I can buy those bamboo for artworks.
> 
> Another concept for the arrow rest and power band is from here.
> http://www.coconutst...%201%20Pana.htm
> 
> The arrowhead idea comes from this. I think tiny copper tubes can be used instead.
> http://web.archive.o...tubepointx.html
> 
> I've never used it for hunting, but I believe a larger one with heavier arrow with a big broadhead can kill any small games easily, the only concern is the accuracy. I've thought of making one out of thick PVC pipe, using a PVC cap to replicate the bamboo knot for the arrow channel and epoxy something for the arrow rest. But I don't think I can make it precisely using only a coping saw, it's not easy to shape. I've to consider that! Whatever works!


Observing these artifacts I sometimes feel clumsy and handicapped. Without my technological environnment I'd die from starvation in no time. The same if I were to kill my rabbit for dinner, let alone the (sad) fact that the safest spot for my potential game would actually be my line of fire.
Coming back to topic I think that, all considered, a slingshot with adequate ammo would be more effective to take down small game, whereas your bamboo stick would be more suitable for fishing.
Yesterday it was Holiday here in Italy, so I had a go to flechettes building. I used a square band fisherman's sling (the one used to launch bait), cutting the pouch and replacing it with 2 loose rings (Joergs style).
Some data:
diameter 5 mm
length 150 mm
weight unknown
draw power unknown
shooting distance 6 metres
target 30 mm plank (pinewood)
shoots 15
hits 13
max penetration 20 mm (the portion filed to sharpen the point, the threaded section hinders penetration)
I'll add some pictures as soon as I find the connection cable with may laptop.

notes: 2 shots went wild, probably because the fork prongs were not perfectly perpendicular with the line of fire. The dart didn't backfire, thouhg.
since the fork was high enough and rather wide the danger of "fiendly fire" was extremely minimized, nevertheless it's no toy to handle carelessly. One of the shots which went amiss neatly pierced a paint tin can, so some sort of protection is highly recommended.

Unless it is a "last trench" question, such as a close encounter with one of these that wouldn't listen to your assurances of friendship and, on account of past experiences isn't quite prone to believe you to be a peaceful democratic hiker, but rather one of those "sobs" that kept it chained and starving for a very long time, and therefore would charge, eager to take its rightful revenge, undeterred by the firecrackers Sabaca and I are frantically throwing to talk it out of the risk of certain death it is running because of our flechettes. Then, surprisingly, I hit it with a 8 mm flechette (my rate is one successful hit out of ten and it just happens to be my tenth shot). that's when the monster decides to eat me alive instead of merely breaking me a few secondary bones as it was its original plan, in that, after all, it is always the best man's friend.

Below a splendid specimen of "One of these" (about 65 to 100 kg, not a grizzly for sure, yet....) that for centuries has shielded our herds against predators such as wolves and bears, yet occasionally playing the predator itself when the shepherd was to mean with the nourishment:


----------



## bunnymansp

Hrawk said:


> To repeat what Joerg said, Simply Brilliant!!!
> 
> When the zombies finally come (and they will) I'm heading straight for the hardware store!


im bored when are the zombies gonna show up


----------



## bunnymansp

Hrawk said:


> To repeat what Joerg said, Simply Brilliant!!!
> 
> When the zombies finally come (and they will) I'm heading straight for the hardware store!


when are they gonna show up im bored


----------



## xizero

Hi i'm working on a double barrel launcher looks something like the attachment - uses a Hook bolt that is hammered down shortened and sharpened for the hook and the arrow head.. i use the hook as a form of barb so that it stays in the target - let me know what you think


----------



## xizero

the idea is to use rollers that are able to slide forwards to tension the bands so that you effectively could carry the bow in the safe position then when needing to fire move the rollers forward and tension the bands .


----------



## combowslingguy 1

Tex-Shooter said:


> Am I missing something! Why even use a threaded rod, just use a steel or aluminum rod and grind a notch near the tip like Blair's short arrows. Then use the tape for fletching. The notch near the tip has been used for a long time, at least 40 years.
> http://www.combowslingguy.com/


Thank you for mentioning my short arrows.This has probably been used for a hundred years or more. Maybe for firing various toys. Spear guns use notches cut the other way.. Thanks again, Robert Blair


----------



## NoSugarRob

slingor said:


> Actually, it was developed by myself out of desperation. Taking ideas from here and there, and it works! It sucks that I don't know where I can buy those bamboo for artworks.
> 
> Another concept for the arrow rest and power band is from here.
> http://www.coconutst...%201%20Pana.htm
> 
> The arrowhead idea comes from this. I think tiny copper tubes can be used instead.
> http://web.archive.o...tubepointx.html
> 
> I've never used it for hunting, but I believe a larger one with heavier arrow with a big broadhead can kill any small games easily, the only concern is the accuracy. I've thought of making one out of thick PVC pipe, using a PVC cap to replicate the bamboo knot for the arrow channel and epoxy something for the arrow rest. But I don't think I can make it precisely using only a coping saw, it's not easy to shape. I've to consider that! Whatever works!


Observing these artifacts I sometimes feel clumsy and handicapped. Without my technological environnment I'd die from starvation in no time. The same if I were to kill my rabbit for dinner, let alone the (sad) fact that the safest spot for my potential game would actually be my line of fire.
Coming back to topic I think that, all considered, a slingshot with adequate ammo would be more effective to take down small game, whereas your bamboo stick would be more suitable for fishing.
Yesterday it was Holiday here in Italy, so I had a go to flechettes building. I used a square band fisherman's sling (the one used to launch bait), cutting the pouch and replacing it with 2 loose rings (Joergs style).
Some data:
diameter 5 mm
length 150 mm
weight unknown
draw power unknown
shooting distance 6 metres
target 30 mm plank (pinewood)
shoots 15
hits 13
max penetration 20 mm (the portion filed to sharpen the point, the threaded section hinders penetration)
I'll add some pictures as soon as I find the connection cable with may laptop.

notes: 2 shots went wild, probably because the fork prongs were not perfectly perpendicular with the line of fire. The dart didn't backfire, thouhg.
since the fork was high enough and rather wide the danger of "fiendly fire" was extremely minimized, nevertheless it's no toy to handle carelessly. One of the shots which went amiss neatly pierced a paint tin can, so some sort of protection is highly recommended.

Unless it is a "last trench" question, such as a close encounter with one of these that wouldn't listen to your assurances of friendship and, on account of past experiences isn't quite prone to believe you to be a peaceful democratic hiker, but rather one of those "sobs" that kept it chained and starving for a very long time, and therefore would charge, eager to take its rightful revenge, undeterred by the firecrackers Sabaca and I are frantically throwing to talk it out of the risk of certain death it is running because of our flechettes. Then, surprisingly, I hit it with a 8 mm flechette (my rate is one successful hit out of ten and it just happens to be my tenth shot). that's when the monster decides to eat me alive instead of merely breaking me a few secondary bones as it was its original plan, in that, after all, it is always the best man's friend.

Below a splendid specimen of "One of these" (about 65 to 100 kg, not a grizzly for sure, yet....) that for centuries has shielded our herds against predators such as wolves and bears, yet occasionally playing the predator itself when the shepherd was to mean with the nourishment:
[/quote]

that dog is a ruddy pyrenean mountain dog. them things are bleedin HUGE ! ........i know this because one tried to EAT ME ! ...... i shall tell you my story, gather quietly around boys and girls









so im a child, delivering newspapers for extra cash...... the free local papers (heavy things they were)....... i have not been out long (paper bag still full and heavy)... and i'm doing a row of houses on a steep hill. i see this THING !! come hurtling out the front door of a house a little further down the hill... the THING locks on to me as if by bleedin radar .......WOOF ! ! ruddy WOOF ! ! ..... i tell you people I ALMOST SOILED MY PANTS !! ..... I takes off up the hill trying to run and get the paper bag off over my head, but its very heavy !! .. i have gone the colour of BOILD ****E by now because im totally sure the THING is gonna be on me any second .... legs like jelly, stomach in knots, hard to breathe !! ... I manage to dump the paper bag and i jumped onto the bonnet of a car just as THE THING got to me... IT WAS RUDDY MASSIVE !!! .... i climbed onto the ROOF of the car and this THING could almost still reach me !!!!!!!!!! .......... a woman then came out of the house with a tinny little lead / leash yelling ORVIL, ORVIL, leave that young man alone Orvil ............... what sort of a name FOR A RUDDY MONSTER IS ORVIL ????? ......... i lived by the way and i think only a little bit of wee came out


----------

