# Hunting Ammo



## frosty2

What is the best / your favorite projectile for the humane, practical harvest of small game appropriate to slingshot hunting? Do you need .60 cal. lead or will 1/2 inch steel do the job? Do you have a special "super ammo" to share with the crowd? Share your thoughts.

frosty2


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## Sam

frosty2 said:


> What is the best / your favorite projectile for the humane, practical harvest of small game appropriate to slingshot hunting? Do you need .60 cal. lead or will 1/2 inch steel do the job? Do you have a special "super ammo" to share with the crowd? Share your thoughts.
> 
> frosty2


Well steel can achieve clean kills but , IMHO, you're strictly limited to head-shots, to be honest all you really have to consider is the fact that lead is 44% denser to realise that lead is going to be superior for hunting. That being said, lead can be hard to obtain in countries with strict gun laws (like over here







,) is toxic and makes a horrible mess in your pockets - they used to use it to make pencils!









As Justin (Fish) says: "If steel was better the army would be using it!"


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## Nico

I usually make my kills with 6/8 and 7/8 stones weighing 14 to 20 grams very effective kills even with a body shot..

I have also killed some crows one with a 1/4 oz lead egg sinker and two crows with 44 cal lead balls I bought from Fish. 
If your going lead you cant lose by using 44 cal, or 50 cal if you have a heavy hitting bandset.


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## Tex-Shooter

Cut off wheel weights Mate! -- Tex


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## whipcrackdeadbunny

Most shots would cause enough damage for a small critter to go into shock I think, they only have very small hearts; I've heard an older man telling me of how he killed pigeons with cherry stones when he was young, but I think it's about distance to pressure ratios mainly, so you'd need to judge each shot and target personally ... even a cross wind can take pressure from a close shot.


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## jmplsnt

My two cents: I have done the majority of my killing with .44 and .50 lead round balls. As I have said before I have never shot a rabbit that moved beyond its tracks with either of these two lead round ball sizes. I've also used conical pistol bullets in the past for their tumbling characteristic in some situations. The impact of these is absolutely devastating.

As I have a month's worth of grass to cut tomorrow (I work offshore) I have to get a bullet trap set up. I've put back a stash of stones over the past month or two and want to try this. These were the first ammo used in slingshots and have bagged staggering amounts of game from back in the day to the present. I'm certain that as I sit here typing this an indigenous family is sitting down at the table, saying grace, and grubbing down on something invited to dinner with a well-placed stone. I shot some down at my pond Friday and was both surprised and extremely pleased with accuracy at 12-17 yard range. I would have no qualms about their use.

If you are looking for one size to use I'd go with the .44 lead round ball; it's pretty much the gold standard though of course everyone has their favorite. It's worked all over the world on all kinds of stuff. And while I haven't killed with stones I think they might be the ticket with their immediate dumping of all their energy upon impact versus penetrating like the lead round balls. Nico's the stones expert and if he's half as right about them as he was with the chained 32's we should all be out filling our pockets with them right now.


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## Nico

jmplsnt said:


> My two cents: I have done the majority of my killing with .44 and .50 lead round balls. As I have said before I have never shot a rabbit that moved beyond its tracks with either of these two lead round ball sizes. I've also used conical pistol bullets in the past for their tumbling characteristic in some situations. The impact of these is absolutely devastating.
> 
> As I have a month's worth of grass to cut tomorrow (I work offshore) I have to get a bullet trap set up. I've put back a stash of stones over the past month or two and want to try this. These were the first ammo used in slingshots and have bagged staggering amounts of game from back in the day to the present. I'm certain that as I sit here typing this an indigenous family is sitting down at the table, saying grace, and grubbing down on something invited to dinner with a well-placed stone. I shot some down at my pond Friday and was both surprised and extremely pleased with accuracy at 12-17 yard range. I would have no qualms about their use.
> 
> If you are looking for one size to use I'd go with the .44 lead round ball; it's pretty much the gold standard though of course everyone has their favorite. It's worked all over the world on all kinds of stuff. And while I haven't killed with stones I think they might be the ticket with their immediate dumping of all their energy upon impact versus penetrating like the lead round balls. Nico's the stones expert and if he's half as right about them as he was with the chained 32's we should all be out filling our pockets with them right now.


Here are some good stones one egg shaped nearest my thumb all compared in size to a black 7/8" marble.








The secret is shape and weight, look for 14 to 20 gram stones all are granite or another igneous rock very hard and dense. The slings stone selection is the same methodology in the selection of resortera/catapult hunting ammo. Basically oval shapes and round shapes will give you a good accuracy for a long range, already field proven that the football shaped stones will strike well at 25+ yards (rabbit crunch). Did a demo for an old friend of my wife at his cabin in the hills, took a 20 gram oval stone and shot at a tree 30 meters away with my chained devil and a second later you could hear and see the stone crunch into the branches of this tree. Needless to say he was shocked that something homemade with rubberbands had that kind of force


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## shot in the foot

I use 8mm steel balls for game birds and 12 to 14mm lead for rabbits, or 1/2iinch steel nuts, you can get a good grip with them with them having a hole in them, and rats i hit with anything even my fist if i get close, i hate them, jeff


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## Sam

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## Sam

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## NaturalFork

Lit quarter sticks would work.


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## Nico

[/quote]
Granite is only just denser than the glass which is used to make marbles so I personally don't value it. I do however understand that people in the third world simply may not have access to industrial materials like lead and steel so I can sympathise with their choices. But we in the first world have these resources available to us in an abundance so I am perplexed as to why you would actively choose to use something more primitive and ultimately less humane.









*PS: I'm offering to send a small packages of 0.44 lead or 0.50 steel to anyone who has a genuine pest problem and cannot afford or obtain suitable ammunition; pro bono of course. 
*
Sam,

Everyone is entitled to their opinions that is what makes us uniquely human.. However you tend offer opinions based on mere conjecture which obviously stem from a lack of experience.

I have plenty of lead some .50 cal that I bought from Perry and some 44 cal lead from fish and I have giant bag of assorted calibers hand casted lead given me by my amigo jmplsnt.

I also have 14 mm steel balls, and 16 mm steel balls donated by a mechanic friend at work and 1/2 inch hex nuts. I can use all of this ammo but I use stone because I know what it does. If you think people in 3rd world countries cant acquire any of this stuff then you really dont know anything about those places. Yet they and myself included use stone regardless.

Now from my 25 + years of experience I know already (from actually shooting animals) what the different types of igneous rock/stones can and cant do to prey. I knew these as river stones when I was a kid because we collected these from the river's edge or arroyos, I also know that they have been used to take animals as large as a fox and I know one such man who did this.

I didnt read a book or visit a forum to learn about stones and their killing power I actually used this ammo.

I wont waste my time trying to convince you otherwise as I am content with what I achieve with this original slingshot ammo.

But I will be sure and tell the next jackrabbit, squirrel, skunk or possum that I shoot with a heavy granite or basalt stone "That _Sam said you dont have to die fast because granite is only slightly denser than glass_"


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## Sam

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## jmplsnt

I've killed in the past all the way to 35 yards using plain old marbles. Those doves were dead before they fell off the powerline. No penetration and no lead.

My thoughts on the lead are yes, they are wonderful ammunition and easily replicated. Anyone with lead, mould, and heat can make them and that has fueled its meteoric rise to the top of slingshot ammunition world.

Some years ago I wrote an article titled "Slingshot: Siderarm of the Backwoodsman" for Backwoodsman Magazine. It was several pages long and at the time I too scorned the use of marbles and stones. I felt the only suitable ammunition for hunting was either lead round balls or the mighty (and still the hardest-hitting of them all) tumbling conical. To quote myself "if you want to throw rocks, go and get yourself a sling" and "marbles were made to be pieces of a game". At the time I was a lead snob.

What I didn't know or understand was all that time Nico was filling his pot as I killed cans with my lead balls. Yes, I have made my share of kills using the lead (with a limited amount using the marbles, too). If you tallied up the grand total of stones vs. lead balls it wouldn't even be close. No contest! Remember why we even have a slingshot to shoot lead round balls with--it was passed down to us by those who pioneered the way using stones. They have been filling the pot out of neccisity and not as a hobby.

I've done some shooting with stones lately and the impacts they make on cans, rabbit-sized rocks, firewood pieces, and cardboard boxes have convinced me they would not only work but work quite well for hunting. A lead round ball wastes a lot of its energy on a pass-through. A stone dumps every singe fpe upon impact. Complete and total transfer of energy. Isn't that the goal of the expanding bullet people on this forum are trying to invent? To me, your "third world families" have already solved this in their patient, non-chest-thumping manner 150 years ago.

I was wrong to have made such proclamations years back when I wrote my article (still a pretty good piece of work though). When I make my next kill it will be with a stone as I'm trying to take the catapult back to where it used to be and while this may not be your path please don't down me or others who are doing things our own way. In closing, I'll say that you (Sam) have a proclivity to down other's work (the chains) having never made or stretched one, much less letting fly with (prepare yourself) a stone or marble. You know, there are things in your signature I don't agree with at all and I'll openly state I can't stand Theraband (or as I call it Tear-a-band) but I don't punch holes in people's work or label them "third world". That's just a cut above some other words I am thinking of. Come to think of it, as a surviving indigenous person (Adais Caddo) does this permit me to shoot stones and chains? Perhaps my primitive mindset is why these draw me.

If you don't mind I've got to go and shoot some arrows (stone-tipped, as us primitives can't get good materials) at some cowboys.


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## Nico

Sam said:


> OK, OK so I may lack a little life experience, but I still think know that I'm right!


I dont have time for this adolescent nonsense.. Frosty wanted the members different ammo favorites from_ actual slingshot hunters_ so I gave mine.


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## ZDP-189

Sam just let it drop. People are getting tired of it. Let people make their suggestions. It's not all about specs and stats. A cherry stone in the hands of a top shooter is more likely to give a clean kill on a small bird than a lead slug in the hands of someone like myself.


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## shot in the foot

Yes Sam be a good lad, i use stones for game birds, cant beat a good free ammo, i even collect them from car parks when im shopping for the wife, i used to have a place were i could collect stones that had iron ore in they were brill, ive even used a 1p piece before when ive ran out, jeff


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## jmplsnt

I've heard good things from some other peope who I think were in the UK about the iron ore pieces. I have never seen one myself but from what I understand they were top-notch.

I just went down to the little trickle that meanders across my property and made some pretty decent shots (including a couple of perfect ones) with stones. I'm pretty excited about where this is leading me. I'm trying to find some closure for the not-so-nice things I said about stones in my article, if you can't tell.


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## frosty2

I got hit in head real good with a stone once... if I was a rabbit I would be dead.
frosty2


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## NoSugarRob

.


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## Sam

NoSugarRob said:


> har har Sam got told off an stuff


Yeah, I'm licking my wounds.







I'm going to delete everything I said...


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## philly

I'm going outside and look for some nice oval/round stones right now.
Philly


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## Nico

jmplsnt said:


> I've heard good things from some other peope who I think were in the UK about the iron ore pieces. I have never seen one myself but from what I understand they were top-notch.
> 
> I just went down to the little trickle that meanders across my property and made some pretty decent shots (including a couple of perfect ones) with stones. I'm pretty excited about where this is leading me. I'm trying to find some closure for the not-so-nice things I said about stones in my article, if you can't tell.


Jmp,

Dont worry about what you said in your article on stones, its really just a matter of not having experienced their uses in hunting thats all. My maternal Grandfather as a kid to help feed the family with his resortera made from Mezquite natural strapped with the old red innertube took countless Jackrabbits, Rabbits, Doves, Pigeons, Rattlesnakes and a large species of country rodent larger than a rabbit. All killed with the old red inntertube resortera and nice round river stones









Now imagine what the 5 per link cadenas can do with these stones at a higher rate of speed?

In the Southern States of Mexico on into the Yucatan Iguanas are hunted with the round solid elastic using again only stones, now these creatures reach 6' in length by no means a small prey at all just some of the many that fall to stones.

So many different kinds of igneous rock exist and some contain as their mineral content, ferromagnesium basically iron and magnesium and iron silicate in addition to other metallic or similar minerals. All of these natural elements make for a very dense stone. I'm no geological expert and when I collect my ammo I simply go by the feel, gently toss the stone in my palm and if it lands with a good thud I know its a good stone. Its just something that takes practice but there are countless hunters who have used this ammo who would just nodd knowingly about their effectiveness.

Keep the faith Amigo


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## Darb

The answer would seem to reduce to this: use whatever is readily available, and which offers the best compromise between expense, accuracy, and imparted energy (which in turn is a factor of mass and aerodynamics). Stones are reasonably omnipresent, and free, and puchased metal balls have better and more consistent aerodymanics and (due to higher mass) higher impact for a given size. Premium ammo has it's advantages (particularly at medium and long range), but natural ammo works well too, if you know what to look for ... human survival is proof of that.


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## shot in the foot

when im finished hunting i always have a bit of fun, i put a target on a fence post and i shoot Rose hips at it, they ae envirement friendly, and they will dent a coke can, jeff

rose hips


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## whipcrackdeadbunny

shot in the foot said:


> when im finished hunting i always have a bit of fun, i put a target on a fence post and i shoot Rose hips at it, they ae envirement friendly, and they will dent a coke can, jeff
> 
> rose hips


They dent coke cans? I like to use Hazel nuts when I'm playing around, or walnuts.


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## whipcrackdeadbunny

Sam said:


> har har Sam got told off an stuff


Yeah, I'm licking my wounds.







I'm going to delete everything I said...
[/quote]

You've had to do that a few times now Sam, are you learning?


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## Tex-Shooter

China Berries. -- Tex


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## whipcrackdeadbunny

Tex-Shooter said:


> China Berries. -- Tex


What's another name for them, Tex?


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## philly

Acorns work for me.
Phil


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## Nico

shot in the foot said:


> when im finished hunting i always have a bit of fun, i put a target on a fence post and i shoot Rose hips at it, they ae envirement friendly, and they will dent a coke can, jeff
> 
> rose hips


Rosehips are rich in Vitamim C looks like you have a great score of rosehips at that, dry some and make some rosehip tea, a good boost of vitamin C is good for the body and tea for the soul.


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## jmplsnt

In the immortal classic tale of the WW2-era South, the author of My Dog Skip gives a good account of a slingshot fight between some neighborhood kids. He dispatches one of his opponents with a chinaberry shot to the left nostril. Surely this removed the antagonist instantly! I can't tell you how much fun I've had reading this account, not to mention the whole book (it's my favorite ever) over and over.

I know this is a "hunting ammunition" thread and I apologise for hijacking.

I've read on another forum of a fellow using chestnuts in a park for squirrels. Hit in the head at close range, they died instantly. He also stated that any lost ammunition would be consumed by still-living squirrels, thus removing anyone catching on to his little racket.

The stones in my part of Arkansas (and in the tiny little brook on my place) are water-rounded sandstone. They aren't as perfectly rounded as I would like (though some are pretty good) and while they aren't as dense as quartz they are saturated with water which does impart extra weight. I have zero doubts these would be good to 20 yards based on my present ability and limitations of the stones themselves. Still I like them as they are what I have on-hand here on my own property, 100% natural, and gathered by myself. I've also got some very fine round quartz pebbles picked up in Missouri that would probably be good even further out. I'm saving these for my next kill oppurtunity and carry three in my pocket everywhere I go.

Nico, on the boat I have been working on with Mexican deck officers/Captains and several of them have had good resortera stories. One of them was quite the Hombre de Resorteras who still made, shot, and hunted with them presently and also had taught his boys everything he knew about them. He lives down in southern Mexico and regaled me with stories of using his naturals with the solid tubing to take iguanas and other prey from boyhood to the present day. I know the solid tubing probably isn't as fast or space-age but I can definately now see a good-sized stone propelled at 150-160 fps would provide all the pot meat one needed.


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## whipcrackdeadbunny

Nico said:


> when im finished hunting i always have a bit of fun, i put a target on a fence post and i shoot Rose hips at it, they ae envirement friendly, and they will dent a coke can, jeff
> 
> rose hips


Rosehips are rich in Vitamim C looks like you have a great score of rosehips at that, dry some and make some rosehip tea, a good boost of vitamin C is good for the body and tea for the soul.
[/quote]

ere-ere!


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## Tex-Shooter

Chinaberries are just for fun shooting and are very common in Texas. - Tex 
http://hikeexplorer.wordpress.com/exquisite-tree/


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## Tex-Shooter

Chinaberries stay on the tree until spring and become fermented. Birds migrating through that have trouble finding food eat them and get drunk. I have seen them hanging upside down for a while, but they get over it. -- Tex


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## Darb

jmplsnt said:


> The stones in my part of Arkansas (and in the tiny little brook on my place) are water-rounded sandstone. They aren't as perfectly rounded as I would like (though some are pretty good) and while they aren't as dense as quartz they are saturated with water which does impart extra weight. I have zero doubts these would be good to 20 yards based on my present ability and limitations of the stones themselves. Still I like them as they are what I have on-hand here on my own property, 100% natural, and gathered by myself. I've also got some very fine round quartz pebbles picked up in Missouri that would probably be good even further out. I'm saving these for my next kill oppurtunity and carry three in my pocket everywhere I go.


I live on Long Island, which is (pardon the digression into Geology) essentially a big pile of debris left by the Laurentide Glacier a dozen plus millenia ago. The rocks here are accordingly a heady mix of quartz, granite, sandstone, shale, conglomerate, and whatever else the glacier scraped up and dropped here, along with massive amounts of subsurface sand. The exposed sand on south shore beaches is all fine grit ... nice for sunbathing, but useless for slingshotting. However, courtesy of constant winnowing and abrasion by waves, and the absence of rip currents, the shoreline on the north shore, particularly in protected bays, are generously littered with nearly perfect ovals of extremely hard rocks ... mostly quartz. Ideal for slingshotting.

*end digression*


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## whipcrackdeadbunny

Thanks Tex, that's very interesting, I've seen them here in the uk, but they don't ripen. Not usually anyway.


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## wd40

Nico and Jmplsnt,

Yes, Sam does give his opinion a lot of times that is based on mere conjecture without any real-world experience to back it up. But that is why it is called an opinion. He has a right to give it.

And, Sam, I don't think they are getting on you so much for giving your opinion, but for then debating and criticizing other people's opinion. Let them give their opinion, too, without analyzing it all too much,

Sam's opinion was that lead was the way to go. Even jmsplnt said he once thought the same thing and wrote an article about such. But now, after more living and more experience, he sees there are other good options, like stone.

Sam, it seems like reading your last several posts that you are interested in getting more into hunting and it seems like you are interested in finding ammo which will give a clean, humane kill to your prey. You could certainly do well to listen and learn from guys like Nico and Jmsplnt who have more years of experience than you have been alive in the very thing you are interested in.

Like one guy says, "Those who say it can't be done shouldn't interrupt those who are doing it."

Now having said all of that, I am so grateful to have the opportunity over this internet to be able to meet you all and talk to you all and learn from all your opinions about something that I enjoy so much, shooting the slingshot.

So I'm going to get out there and shoot steel and lead and stones and berries and nuts and make my own opinion.

Oh, by the way, speaking of ammo, did you guys see the piece on youtube where Rufus Hussey was being interviewed by his nephew-in-law while he was working at the bench making slingshots? And old Rufus told about the time he went into the barn and saw two mice or rats running around. He had his slingshot with him, but he only had one rock in his pocket.

So old Rufus used the rock he had to shoot the closest mouse, and then he picked that dead mouse up and shot and killed the other mouse with it.

I mean, he shot and killed a mouse with another dead mouse. What a great story.

I love these slingshots.


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## jmplsnt

Well it appears WD40 has it pretty well wrapped up. Yes, I openly scorned the use of stones back in the day and privately until fairly recently. Now I'm pretty interested in them and in fact just got back from shooting some more.

Lead is probably the best we'll ever have for hunting with a slingshot with the round ball taking the wild majority of what is killed. Likewise for Thera-Gold. I'm just a little out of of the box here and wanting to be a bit more primitive. That said while I was down at the pond I delighted in making a first-shot connection at a little over 40 yards on a 5-gallon bucket with a .38 lead round ball fired from my 5-per natural ergo.

Rufus Hussey probably could have shot his dead mouse completely through the bucket at 60+ yards just because he was Rufus Hussey and that counts for a lot in my book.

WD go forth, shoot them all, report your findings (I like your philosophy and outlook) and please share your experiences. Remember, a difference of opinion is not a difference of principle!


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## Dayhiker

Why are there so many empty posts from Sam?

Edit: never mind.


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## Sam

Dayhiker said:


> Why are there so many empty posts from Sam?
> 
> Edit: never mind.


My opinions weren't favourable, so I deleted 'em!


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## Dayhiker

You're a funny guy, Sam. But I like you.


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## Nico

Tex-Shooter said:


> Chinaberries stay on the tree until spring and become fermented. Birds migrating through that have trouble finding food eat them and get drunk. I have seen them hanging upside down for a while, but they get over it. -- Tex


I like that Tex.. Animals too like to or have habits(getting a buzz or getting drunk) that humans were only currently held guilty of.









I've seen dogs do the same with toads in Mexico where they just pick them up drop them drooling and act goofy after taking in some of the bufotoxins, I hear this is also very common in Australia with Cane Toads which are also very common in Mexico lest we forget Cane Toads are indigenous to the New World. I've seen dogs also eat fallen fermented loquats and get goofy afterwards in fact they wouldnt eat the fallen fruit unless it were fermented.

Life is full of wonderous perplexities sometimes and at times it can be as dead as a mausoleum...







Its what we make of it


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## jmplsnt

Darb, I would imagine your glacial till would make fine ammunition. I lived for a time in Alaska and used their rounded stones as sling ammunition as well as for hand-throwing. I don't know why I never made the slingshot connection and can only imagine my prowess had I started then (1995).

I have found that by backing off from a full draw to something a bit more restrained one can shoot stones that are somewhat decently-shaped but aren't up to the spherical/biconical standard. I'm making shots out to 15m no problem with them now with just a little work. Again, I wouldn't want to take to the field with just this type of stuff but in the event it was all I had then by all means I know I can still strike my targets out to that range with some degree of force. It is cooling off here in the Ozarks a little and the time to get back in the field will be very soon!

If anyone else has any experiences with stones, the UK iron ore pellets, china berries, or whatever else you may have come up with (and occasional moments of brillance can strike at any time) please share them with us. I find this a very fascinating thread!


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## Longbow

Well I would love to shoot rocks , but I live in Florida and the only thing we have here is sand on top of more sand. I JUST HAVE TO MAKE DO WITH MARBLES AND STEEL.


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## Dayhiker

You mean on the beach there aren't any smooth stones??? On our beaches up here in the northeast there are plenty!


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## whipcrackdeadbunny

The best stones here in the UK (I find) are the flint-stones; where I am we have lots of small rivers, pushing through a clay soil, left behind after the glaciers, they always have smooth, clean stones, just about the right size for sling-shots or just slings. The flint is round and smooth, from the rivers, and very dense, as is the nature of flint; in the last few days, I've been training a longer distance of shooting, three times now, I've got a 3" high by 1 1/2" wide target, from 30 ft away, with stones just like the ones I've described. It's very satisfying, but the stones are not usually too straight in their flight.


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## whipcrackdeadbunny

Sam said:


> Why are there so many empty posts from Sam?
> 
> Edit: never mind.


My opinions weren't favourable, so I deleted 'em!








[/quote]

I don't think it was the content of the opinion necessarily Sam, but the attitude.


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## Nico

whipcrackdeadbunny said:


> The best stones here in the UK (I find) are the flint-stones; where I am we have lots of small rivers, pushing through a clay soil, left behind after the glaciers, they always have smooth, clean stones, just about the right size for sling-shots or just slings. The flint is round and smooth, from the rivers, and very dense, as is the nature of flint; in the last few days, I've been training a longer distance of shooting, three times now, I've got a 3" high by 1 1/2" wide target, from 30 ft away, with stones just like the ones I've described. It's very satisfying, but the stones are not usually too straight in their flight.


Way to go on your shooting with stones partner! The furthest shots I have recorded for myself was one rabbit with a head shot at 20 yards. I recently in the last few weeks took a feral pigeon with a neck shot 5/8 stone 15' up 25' distance.

I have shot at doves 30 yards away with stones and come within an inch or two of their demise, so it is possible in my experience anyway to get an average 15 to 20 yard accurate range for stones no problem.

Would love to try some of your flint stones..


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## frosty2

My latest experiment is with the "death rings." They are 3/8inch brass washers with a .45 lead ball swagged into the hole. The hole in a 3/8 brass washer is quite a bit larger than 3/8 of an inch, steel washers are too tight. The jury is still out as to their worth but they do make a really cool sound when they ricochet.
frosty2


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## whipcrackdeadbunny

Way to go on your shooting with stones partner! The furthest shots I have recorded for myself was one rabbit with a head shot at 20 yards. I recently in the last few weeks took a feral pigeon with a neck shot 5/8 stone 15' up 25' distance.

I have shot at doves 30 yards away with stones and come within an inch or two of their demise, so it is possible in my experience anyway to get an average 15 to 20 yard accurate range for stones no problem.

Would love to try some of your flint stones..








[/quote]
I was thinking exactly the same for distance, 15-20, I don't try to kill that far yet (maybe 15) I'm still in training, but It's coming on nicely. You provide some cash for postage, we could try posting you some samples, they really are perfect for free ammo, but not really worth entertaining if you can't provide them yourself. Lots of free ammo for me, but no rocks to put in the fire at night, 'cause they explode.


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## whipcrackdeadbunny

frosty2 said:


> My latest experiment is with the "death rings." They are 3/8inch brass washers with a .45 lead ball swagged into the hole. The hole in a 3/8 brass washer is quite a bit larger than 3/8 of an inch, steel washers are too tight. The jury is still out as to their worth but they do make a really cool sound when they ricochet.
> frosty2


How's the trajectory on them?


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## frosty2

whipcrackdeadbunny said:


> My latest experiment is with the "death rings." They are 3/8inch brass washers with a .45 lead ball swagged into the hole. The hole in a 3/8 brass washer is quite a bit larger than 3/8 of an inch, steel washers are too tight. The jury is still out as to their worth but they do make a really cool sound when they ricochet.
> frosty2


How's the trajectory on them?
[/quote]

They seem to be a short range proposition. They have a problem with consistency as they slow down.
frosty2


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## Sam

I'd love to see a direct comparison between some steel, lead and stone bullets in 20% gelatin, might disprove my scepticism. Or even a video of a clean kill with a stone, do you have a camera Nico?


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## Nico

]


Sam said:


> I'd love to see a direct comparison between some steel, lead and stone bullets in 20% gelatin, might disprove my scepticism. Or even a video of a clean kill with a stone, do you have a camera Nico?


Took this rabbit some months ago with one of my chained rubber slingshots and some stones are in the pic. Was a 20 yard head shot which my brother in law witnessed. Would have photoed the gory side of the head but wasnt thinking that mattered to my hunting buddies at the shed which is where I orginally posted this. The stone made a hole in its head and it was a 6/8 river stone.







And they werent nearly as perfect a stone as the kind I take the time to select from my usual places.


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## frosty2

Nico said:


> I'd love to see a direct comparison between some steel, lead and stone bullets in 20% gelatin, might disprove my scepticism. Or even a video of a clean kill with a stone, do you have a camera Nico?


Took this rabbit some months ago with one of my chained rubber slingshots and some stones are in the pic. Was a 20 yard head shot which my brother in law witnessed. Would have photoed the gory side of the head but wasnt thinking that mattered to my hunting buddies at the shed which is where I orginally posted this. The stone made a hole in its head and it was a 6/8 river stone.

View attachment 3260
And they werent nearly as perfect a stone as the kind I take the time to select from my usual places.
[/quote]

This makes me think that now, when the dog and I are out walking in the woods, I should be looking for good rocks as well as good forks.
frosty2


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## Sam

Nico said:


> I'd love to see a direct comparison between some steel, lead and stone bullets in 20% gelatin, might disprove my scepticism. Or even a video of a clean kill with a stone, do you have a camera Nico?


Took this rabbit some months ago with one of my chained rubber slingshots and some stones are in the pic. Was a 20 yard head shot which my brother in law witnessed. Would have photoed the gory side of the head but wasnt thinking that mattered to my hunting buddies at the shed which is where I orginally posted this. The stone made a hole in its head and it was a 6/8 river stone.

View attachment 3260
And they werent nearly as perfect a stone as the kind I take the time to select from my usual places.
[/quote]
I'm very impressed!







How long did it take to die? And how consistently do you achieve 1 hit kills?









I think the main reason I'm opposed to using stones and marbles is because they're suitable for hunting in the experienced hands of someone like yourself Nico, but the second a moron, like myself, tries to imitate you animals will be experiencing unnecessary pain!


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## philly

Found about a dozen semi round stones at the beach yesterday while clamimg. Only one out of the 12 I picked up was close to perfect. That one at 10 M shot reasonably well the rest pretty erratic. I think if one was to spend enough time you could get fairly comsistent ammo. They do smack a can with athourity, lead for me, I am to lazy to find enough perfect stones for as much shooting i do.
Philly


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## huey224

shot in the foot said:


> I use 8mm steel balls for game birds and 12 to 14mm lead for rabbits, or 1/2iinch steel nuts, you can get a good grip with them with them having a hole in them, and rats i hit with anything even my fist if i get close, i hate them, jeff


but dont hex nuts fly off in an odd direction?


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## Nico

Sam said:


> I'd love to see a direct comparison between some steel, lead and stone bullets in 20% gelatin, might disprove my scepticism. Or even a video of a clean kill with a stone, do you have a camera Nico?


Took this rabbit some months ago with one of my chained rubber slingshots and some stones are in the pic. Was a 20 yard head shot which my brother in law witnessed. Would have photoed the gory side of the head but wasnt thinking that mattered to my hunting buddies at the shed which is where I orginally posted this. The stone made a hole in its head and it was a 6/8 river stone.

View attachment 3260
And they werent nearly as perfect a stone as the kind I take the time to select from my usual places.
[/quote]
I'm very impressed!







How long did it take to die? And how consistently do you achieve 1 hit kills?









I think the main reason I'm opposed to using stones and marbles is because they're suitable for hunting in the experienced hands of someone like yourself Nico, but the second a moron, like myself, tries to imitate you animals will be experiencing unnecessary pain!









[/quote]

Well Sam,

The impact of the stone was powerful enough to have spun the rabbit around and it was quite dead upon impact, the body trembled for a few seconds before its lights went out.

No death is truly humane as the body feels everything, but the brain has a built in emergency mechanism which releases pain endorphins to ease pain and cause euphoria; this is all triggered by shock to the body.

Unless your a vegetarian then you could appreciate the minimal pain of such a catapult kill when compared to what happens to poultry or cattle at the local slaughterhouse.

For the record I prefer stones to marbles although I have killed my share of pigeons and doves with marbles all were vital shots, head and neck shots. Stones are very much more dense than a marble and even pigeons and doves die to a stoned chest shot, so to answer your question virtually all the prey I have shot with stones usually die on impact.

The 6/8 stone that killed the rabbit was semi round and weighed I estimate 10 grams as it felt slightly heavier than a 44 cal lead ball. The weight of a stone is largely proportionate to its actual mineral content, I havent killed anything with steel balls yet and that for me would be a novel kill.

Sometimes the animal's nerves continue after death, this happend with a rattlesnake I killed about a month ago with my chained devil slingshot again a stone kill. I shot the rattler in the head from 10' feet away while he was in motion, my goofy brother in law was afraid as the near 3' viper was moving and striking at itself with a broken skull quite dead. I cut the head off to prevent any danger of a fang puncture and skinned the snake and saved the meat for some rattler tacos. My point even without a head the serpent moved about and rattled.

YOU see death is quite a mysterious thing and not all clinical things will explain it fully, its heart beat well after I gutted the snake when saving the meat.


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## Nico

huey224 said:


> I use 8mm steel balls for game birds and 12 to 14mm lead for rabbits, or 1/2iinch steel nuts, you can get a good grip with them with them having a hole in them, and rats i hit with anything even my fist if i get close, i hate them, jeff


but dont hex nuts fly off in an odd direction?
[/quote]

Hex nuts spin a bit when you shoot them and can have a good accuracy up to 30 yards they are best for furry creatures.
Larger feathered creatures like a hen/pheasant will survive if the hexnut hits the armor like feathered area unless a head shot with the hex nut it will get away.

Rabbits, Squizzies and the like dont have feathered vests and are great for hexnuts..


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## Darb

I suppose that's one way to "put a hex" on someone.


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## whipcrackdeadbunny

The human body is still not fully understood by science, look at the lymphatic system, the immune system, the spleen; let alone the brain, which is almost unknown to modern science. And yet, the human body is probably the most studied thing in the world, by humans.


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## Xidoo

I live in a "third world country" and I am very proud of it. We have access to all kind of things just like people in "first world countries." As long you have the money you can buy or get anything. Money is the key to everything in this world. I could buy any kind of slingshot or ammo in the world if it is on sale, or might try to buy it offering the right amount of money. I could get ammo for my slingshot made out or clay, stone, glass, takonite, steel, lead, etc, there is even some stones used in the oil industry used to clean oil containers very dense and perfectly round to shoot with and some of the guys from the "first world" have never used them. So, do not understimate people or countries, based on if ther are "first or third world countries. 
My wife's cousin got maried to this guy whose last name is Endean. His father arrived from Liverpool to Merida, Mexico.He got married, had two kids and never went back to England. He died and got buried here in Mexico. His wife used to said that he was proud to say that he was Mexican, although he was not. So, Sam" the first world" is not that perfect....


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## wildman

Im new at this and was wondering if dried beans e.g. whole peas would work? or any other roundish type bean?


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## jmplsnt

Wildman I have knowledge of a pheasant taken with something known as an aniseed in the UK. I've also heard of someone head-shooting squirrels at close range with chestnuts. I personally have fired some hickory nuts out of my hybrid Mexican Gypsy and at less than full draw they tracked fairly straight out to 10 or so yards. Too much speed and the lighter weight/lower density had them going "nuts" if you don't mind a pun.

Xidoo, if it's not too much trouble I'd love to see some pictures of these cleaning stones you're talking about. I can only imagine what perfectly round, tumbled stones would be like fired out of a resortera. Based on my extremely limited experience shooting stones I could only imagine spherical ones. And the larger pouch of the resortera is ready to both recieve and fire them!

Finally, I respect the Mexican shooters as theirs is one of the few remaining slingshot cultures left and really one of very few we can actually communicate with the native shooters themselves. True, my slingshots show a strong Mexican influence (gracias a mi amigo el jefe de las cadenas) but in the end they're just copies of something I saw and "lifted" for my own use. There are some other slingshot cultures out there (I'm thinking Ivory Coast in Africa and the Indians of Guatemala) but no way to communicate with them. Traditionalist Mexicans have both their resorteras and laptops, and I'm happy to learn from and adopt their methods.


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## wildman

jmplsnt said:


> Wildman I have knowledge of a pheasant taken with something known as an aniseed in the UK. I've also heard of someone head-shooting squirrels at close range with chestnuts. I personally have fired some hickory nuts out of my hybrid Mexican Gypsy and at less than full draw they tracked fairly straight out to 10 or so yards. Too much speed and the lighter weight/lower density had them going "nuts" if you don't mind a pun.
> 
> Xidoo, if it's not too much trouble I'd love to see some pictures of these cleaning stones you're talking about. I can only imagine what perfectly round, tumbled stones would be like fired out of a resortera. Based on my extremely limited experience shooting stones I could only imagine spherical ones. And the larger pouch of the resortera is ready to both recieve and fire them!
> 
> Finally, I respect the Mexican shooters as theirs is one of the few remaining slingshot cultures left and really one of very few we can actually communicate with the native shooters themselves. True, my slingshots show a strong Mexican influence (gracias a mi amigo el jefe de las cadenas) but in the end they're just copies of something I saw and "lifted" for my own use. There are some other slingshot cultures out there (I'm thinking Ivory Coast in Africa and the Indians of Guatemala) but no way to communicate with them. Traditionalist Mexicans have both their resorteras and laptops, and I'm happy to learn from and adopt their methods.


Thanx Jmplsnt, i got a little excited when i found this site and dug out my old marksman and plowed through a whole bag of garbanzo beans at various targets they sure pack a punch but hard to nail a target, so today im going to buy a **** load of marbles and go on a rampage hehe


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## Xidoo

Xidoo, if it's not too much trouble I'd love to see some pictures of these cleaning stones you're talking about. I can only imagine what perfectly round, tumbled stones would be like fired out of a resortera. Based on my extremely limited experience shooting stones I could only imagine spherical ones. And the larger pouch of the resortera is ready to both recieve and fire them!

_*Hi jmplsnt, at this time I do not have any of those round white rocks. Since I was a little kid I used to see them and thought they were marbles, due to the fact that they were perfectly round, but I was wrong. They are very dense, so really heavy. Sometimes you just find them on the ground. I just was told from a friend who shoots with them that they are used at the local oil company refinary (PEMEX), to clean oil containers. I am sure they are man made just like takonite, but have not idead what are they made of. They are hard to find, but if you are lucky and know somebody who works in the oil company, that person might get you some. I was told too that there is this glass factory, where you can exchange your glass bottles for marbles. I just need to find the please and take my bottles to get free marbles.
Thanks for your respect to Mexican slingshot shooters my father was a great shooter himself and my brother is another one. My respects to you, Saludos.
Xidoo, 
*_


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