# shot size & energy comparison



## bullseyeben! (Apr 24, 2011)

Firstly i know this is filmed with an air rifle, and many may have already seen this, so mods can move this if they have too, but the physics still relate to slingshooting all the same, its an interesting video showing the huge difference and importance of selecting the correct size amo for the game your hunting, don't watch if you dont like hunting!


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## Danny0663 (Mar 15, 2011)

Interesting vid, the energy transfered to the squirrell with the .25 is devistating considering it's punching 42 ft/lb. Clean kill indeed.

Just checked his other video's, he has got some really cool vids.

Thanks for sharing


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## Charles (Aug 26, 2010)

It is an interesting video, because the fellow tried to make the shots comparable. Of course with the pellet rifle, the kill is made by penetration. I believe with the slingshot it is even more important to use larger ammo, because in many cases (I would say the vast majority in my experience), the kill is made by blunt force trauma. The difference between hitting something with 3/8 inch steel versus say .45 caliber lead ball is tremendous in terms of crushing impact.

In my own experience, I got tired of watching big game keep going after being hit with 8mm Mauser or 30-06, which were two calibers I used to hunt with. In fact for the last few years that I hunted with 30-06, I began shooting deer in the spine so they would drop on the spot. I moved to a modern 45-70. Nothing I shot with that moved more than 10 feet ... deer, moose, bear. With the 8mm and the 30-06, the slugs penetrated through and were neatly mushroomed under the hide on the far side (unless I shot them in the spine), just as the hunting dogma at the time dictated. Those small entry wounds tended to seal up and help constrain the bleeding. That 45-70 just punched a half inch hole all the way through both sides, and the animals spewed blood, bleeding out in a matter of seconds. And the interior trauma from that .45 slug was much, much worse that for a .30 slug.

Yes, I know that shooting big game with a high powered rifle is not the same as shooting small game with a slingshot. But my point is, those bigger projectiles cause a lot more blunt trauma. And as the video emphasizes, with large ammo, you can be a bit off target and still get your game. Sure shot placement is important. But if I shoot a rabbit, aiming for its head, and I am off a bit and hit it in the shoulder or chest, a .45 or .50 caliber lead ball is going to be much more likely to be disabling than would 3/8 steel.

Well, that's my opinion, and no doubt others will not agree. I say to each their own ... hunt with what you find comfortable, as long as you are not injuring a lot of game and failing to collect it.

Cheers ...... Charles


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## MrTriscuit (Oct 10, 2011)

Really neat video!


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## newconvert (Dec 12, 2011)

excellent info both BB, and Charles. thanks for the vid BB


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## bullseyeben! (Apr 24, 2011)

No wukkas, as Charles mentioned a ss generally won't have the penetration potential as a speedy air riffle, unless its torsten with heated bands lol, but they do indeed have the potential to deliver a crushing blow with larger shots. As a target shooter myself i rarely shoot larger than 9mm, but the last time I cronies .44 cal I was around 260+ fps that, as many would know causes a lot of energy to differ into whatever it strikes..


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## wiking (Feb 12, 2012)

Ted's got great videos, as an avid airgunner he is one of my idols when it comes down to hunting. I added Ted's Holdover on facebook and I get the new vids posted as soon as they come out.

A slower projectile having larger mass offcourse delivers more energy at impact, simple physics, and I just barely made physics class







I got me .44 round led balls for blackpowder rifles for something like 8US (quick counting) for a hundred balls. I bring a handfull in one pocket and a few marbles for plinking when Im out in the woods. I still have problems with my aim though, beeing new to the sport, and I find the heavier balls harder to aim with.


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## treefork (Feb 1, 2010)

You need to practice with the same ammo you hunt with. Marbles are fast and light with much less impact energy than. 44 lead.


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## bullseyeben! (Apr 24, 2011)

Yeah i like 3/8 ish size ammo for my every day can killing etc, but .44s have their uses.


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## Charles (Aug 26, 2010)

As a compromise, I would suggest trying 3/8 inch cast lead. In my opinion, it would be satisfactory for small birds ... quail, grouse ... not pheasants or anything larger. A 3/8 inch (9.5 mm) steel ball weighs about 54 gr (3.53 gm), while the same size lead ball weighs 79 gr (5.12 gm). I have gotten used to shooting the lead, and those steel balls feel more like plastic to me now! In any case, it is wise to practise with the ammo you intend to use for hunting, as has already been suggested.

Cheers .... Charles


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## Tex-Shooter (Dec 17, 2009)

_I have said this before, but for the new comers I will mention it again. 1/2 inch steel and 44 cal. lead weigh the same, so you can practice with 1/2 inch steel (easier on the back stop and cleaner handling) and hunt with 44 cal. lead. This will give you the same trajectory at comon slingshot distances. -- Tex_


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## whipcrackdeadbunny (May 22, 2010)

Does the size not effect the difference in distance though, Tex?


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## Tex-Shooter (Dec 17, 2009)

_Not out to about 30/40 meters to be noticeable! -- Tex_


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## bullseyeben! (Apr 24, 2011)

Yea air resistance certainly affects flight at range, but not enoufh at hunting or general target distance to adversly affect shooting..


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## Henry the Hermit (Jun 2, 2010)

Yep, size does matter.

Yesterday I posted this picture of a #12 steel can hit with a 173 grain .50 cal lead ball.









Here's a different #12 steel can hit with a 573 grain lead sinker. I put the sinker in the bottom of the can to give an idea of its size. Note that both cans were hit once or twice before being holed. It requires a pretty direct hit to penetrate. You can see the impression of the sinker on the can. It did not penetrate, but ripped the can open from a small tear from a previous shot. Both cans were suspended. I'm reasonably sure that either one of these shots would have killed a squirrel with either a head or chest shot.


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## bullseyeben! (Apr 24, 2011)

Oh yea, thatd do it!


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## Charles (Aug 26, 2010)

Henry, your illustrations are bang on. That heavy ammo has a serious crushing effect that is very lethal on small game.

Cheers ...... Charles


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## Charles (Aug 26, 2010)

O.K. I will relate one more small tale, and then hopefully shut up about this topic. About 10 years ago I had a neighbor who retired here in Victoria from Manitoba. He had a plumbing and heating business there, and was about 90 at the time I knew him. His dad had been a gunsmith, and jack did a lot of gunsmithing on the side ... was the gunsmith for the RCMP there. He liked to build his own rifles, was a fantastic shot even at his age, and he had been a hunter most of his life. He once told me about a hunting trip he and some friends took into northern Manitoba. They were in a camp and had several deer hanging. One afternoon a very large black bear came into camp attracted by the hanging meat and the cooking smells. At that time, Jack was carrying a 9mm auto ... an old WWII Luger I think he said. I do not know whether it was legal in those days, or whether he was not worried because of his close association with the RCMP ... it would not be legal to carry one in the bush now. Anyway, when the bear came into camp, Jack pulled out his pistol and began shooting the bear. He said that he shot it 6 times in the chest, and the bear still wandered back into the bush before finally expiring. His comment was: "That 9mm is great for penetration, but it is a [email protected] poor killer."

Yep ... I know ... shooting something with a pistol is different from shooting it with a slingshot. But I think the lesson is still relevant. If you want to kill small game with a slingshot, stick to pretty big ammo. Worry more about crushing impact than penetration.

Cheers ....... Charles


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