# Copy cat?



## justplainduke (May 31, 2011)

It's often said that imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.
I've read quite a few posts on the topic of using one of our forum members' designs an modifying it to suit our orn personal taste. Does that make it custom then? Is it ethical to copy or customize another persons known design, as long as you're not trying to compete in selling and taking food off of their table? 
I ask this because I am new to the forum and found a deign that I really am impressed with, I built it to suit my needs better but the design remains obviously similar to a respected forum member.
I truly did create a frame and it's not for sale, I would love to show it off to my friends here on the forum without being ostracized. I respect all of you to much and I appeciate the forum.


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## justplainduke (May 31, 2011)

P.s. This tiny keyboard on my iPhone sucks, so please overlook my spelling/grammatical errors


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## bullseyeben! (Apr 24, 2011)

Yea phones, I ear tat... lol
Much has been said recently in regards to copying, and I personally believe that there are only so many shapes and designs that a frame can take, and after a while of course a few will strike a resemblance to an other, after all a slingshot is a simple devise and all has to have a handle and a bit of rubber to function.. I don't sell mine as yet, but have seen some similar designs but over all size and general finish are different, I think unless your making an exact duplicate of a genuine seller, than trying to sell that is wrong, 
making something purely for your needs and are proud of it, go for it... Ben


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## NoSugarRob (Jun 3, 2010)

ya cant please all the people all the time.


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## mark22c (May 28, 2011)

i'de be really flattered if someone copied one of mine! at the end of the day what can you do? you carve a bit of wood to fit your hand.... if you make a few your going to starts seeing resemblances as last time i checked my hands are pretty much the same as most, my eyes are in the same place... its getting harder and harder to come up with original and practical ideas.
im not really making them to sell yet, just trying to find the best frame for me experimenting with different shapes. i've tried incorporating others ideas to see if i like them for my own use.


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## JoergS (Dec 17, 2009)

We had a poll about this issue a while ago. The result lead to a change of the rules. This is Aaron's final post:



> Valued members, I appreciate everyone taking the time to cast their vote on this, and you have spoken. The results of the poll at the time of close, with 198 votes, are:
> 
> 67% - People SHOULD be allowed to clone designs and show them here but NOT sell them without the permission from the original designer
> 21% - People should NOT be allowed to clone designs and show OR sell them here without permission from the original designer
> ...


Basically, most members believe it is OK to copy a design for personal use. Selling a blatant clone is frowned upon, though.

I see no reason to re-open the discussion, as no new aspect came up.


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## NoSugarRob (Jun 3, 2010)

ycpatpatt...... innit


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## Dayhiker (Mar 13, 2010)

NoSugarRob said:


> ycpatpatt...... innit












. . . So Rob, you come from a part ov England where they even _write _in a heavy accent, huh?


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## bullseyeben! (Apr 24, 2011)

Innit..


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## ArjunD (Apr 4, 2011)

Yea abit of wembley cockney doesn't hurt eh? innit ?!


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## bullseyeben! (Apr 24, 2011)

Love.it, wish I could talk like a pom.. good on ya lads


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## Rapier (May 28, 2011)

I joined after that poll took place and have only now become aware of it. Good to know.

The reason I'm replying is because I almost entirely copied one of Bills designs just recently as I thought it was a terriffic design and wanted one like it. Besides the fact it's hard for me to import slingies from overseas (customs has issues with them) I love to make them. I posted my copy of Bills design because I'm proud of how it turned out and wanted feedback (praise on how aces I am) However,,, In my post I made sure everyone knew it was a copy of one of Bills and also directed anyone interested in that design directly to Bill for purchase considering he is a vendor. Anything less and you might pi$$ people off. To try and sell it is blatent theft. Anytime I'm inspired by anothers design I make sure they get credit for their input or ideas in my posts. I hope this is a reasonable and acceptable way to share others brilliance, imagination and workmanship. I'm really enjoying this forum and the people who contribute to it and would hate to step on anyones toes.

So thankyou Bill, Joerg, Flippinout, A+ and the many others who have inspired me to think and improve on my own ideas and level of craftmanship because without the veterans I'd never have even thought of putting my hand to designing and making slingshots.

cheers


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## ArjunD (Apr 4, 2011)

I have copied everyone.

Not only this but Smitty who is just so kind to me sent me his pattern to copy plus 3 other slingshots. So kind and generous.


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## gamekeeper john (Apr 11, 2011)

you should post it so we can have a look! theres is only so much u can do with a catapult frame while still being functional! there are thousends of different types and all have a handle and 2 forks! i have brought 3 DIFFERENT designs out in the past 6 months and all have been classed as a clone of the same catapult even though all 3 were different shapes just with a pinky hole lol, i'v had about enough of all this coppying and cloning crap and will be bringing all my designs out with a pinky hole soon if they look simalar to someone elses or not !!! i look forward to seeing your catapult and feel free to coppy any of my designs whenever you want, they are all in the shared designs forum, cheers john


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## Cap (Jun 22, 2011)

I too would have problems with importing catty's. So, here's a thought...... If designers would sell a selection of designs as PDF files online for a few bucks or punds each. I for one, would be interested.


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## justplainduke (May 31, 2011)

Thank you all for the clarification








I'll post some pics as soon as I can get to a real computer!
~duke


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## NoSugarRob (Jun 3, 2010)

Dayhiker said:


> ycpatpatt...... innit












. . . So Rob, you come from a part ov England where they even _write _in a heavy accent, huh?
[/quote]

innit means isn't it .... used quite a lot in uk comedy....... and ycpatpatt is the first letter of each of the following words... ya can't please all the people all the time.... thats how we speak themz wordz here.. innit. ... i didn't get very good school reports from my english language and literature teacher....... we called him Mr bum face. .... this post haz not been spell checkedd.


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## bullseyeben! (Apr 24, 2011)

NoSugarRob said:


> ycpatpatt...... innit












. . . So Rob, you come from a part ov England where they even _write _in a heavy accent, huh?
[/quote]

innit means isn't it .... used quite a lot in uk comedy....... and ycpatpatt is the first letter of each of the following words... ya can't please all the people all the time.... thats how we speak themz wordz here.. innit. ... i didn't get very good school reports from my english language and literature teacher....... we called him Mr bum face. .... this post haz not been spell checkedd.

[/quote] I've heard thongs and wife beaters aren't welcome in some bloody bars oitside Australia?


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## NoSugarRob (Jun 3, 2010)

bullseyeben! said:


> ycpatpatt...... innit












. . . So Rob, you come from a part ov England where they even _write _in a heavy accent, huh?
[/quote]

innit means isn't it .... used quite a lot in uk comedy....... and ycpatpatt is the first letter of each of the following words... ya can't please all the people all the time.... thats how we speak themz wordz here.. innit. ... i didn't get very good school reports from my english language and literature teacher....... we called him Mr bum face. .... this post haz not been spell checkedd.

[/quote] I've heard thongs and wife beaters aren't welcome in some bloody bars oitside Australia?
[/quote]

don't get it ?


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## bullseyeben! (Apr 24, 2011)

Prob should clarify that one.. A Wife beater apart from the obvious, in Aussie lingo is a singlet, you know a chesty bonds etc, tank top? ! And the bloody thongs ain't no G Banga.. we wears them our feet!... lol like sandals...


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## bullseyeben! (Apr 24, 2011)

Innit


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## NoSugarRob (Jun 3, 2010)

bullseyeben! said:


> Prob should clarify that one.. A Wife beater apart from the obvious, in Aussie lingo is a singlet, you know a chesty bonds etc, tank top? ! And the bloody thongs ain't no G Banga.. we wears them our feet!... lol like sandals...


Dude ! wot are you going on about man ? chesty sandals ? tank tops ? ... speek pom to me man


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## Gwilym (Dec 9, 2010)

A lot of people use wife beater to mean a vest here or stella artois (it has a reputation for making people violent).and by thong I think you mean flipflops. If so yeah there are places which wont allow either item.


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## whipcrackdeadbunny (May 22, 2010)

By wife-beater I think he means string-vest, like our friend to the north, Rab.






And flip-flops.


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## bullseyeben! (Apr 24, 2011)

Oh god... no .....so pale in complection, is there no sun?...joking lads...


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## Gwilym (Dec 9, 2010)

Interesting fact, did you know the Scottish have no word sun.


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## jskeen (Feb 7, 2011)

Gee, all this cool slingshot stuff, and a english?? lesson too. That's like dinner and a show for the same ticket


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## NoSugarRob (Jun 3, 2010)

your all mental you are...














.. you've ruined this thread with ya funny ways ............ an stuff !


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## NoSugarRob (Jun 3, 2010)

whipcrackdeadbunny said:


> By wife-beater I think he means string-vest, like our friend to the north, Rab.
> 
> http://www.youtube.c...ayer_detailpage
> 
> And flip-flops.


Rab c nesbitt was a ruddy fantastic program


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## whipcrackdeadbunny (May 22, 2010)

Too right.


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## dgui (Jan 12, 2010)

justplainduke said:


> It's often said that imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.
> I've read quite a few posts on the topic of using one of our forum members' designs an modifying it to suit our orn personal taste. Does that make it custom then? Is it ethical to copy or customize another persons known design, as long as you're not trying to compete in selling and taking food off of their table?
> I ask this because I am new to the forum and found a deign that I really am impressed with, I built it to suit my needs better but the design remains obviously similar to a respected forum member.
> I truly did create a frame and it's not for sale, I would love to show it off to my friends here on the forum without being ostracized. I respect all of you to much and I appeciate the forum.


I

I don't know if any one relys on making and selling slingshots for a living. If someone is making and selling a particular design series I would consider it to be not within the law to copy and if you want to copy one that is being sold then buy it first. If anyone wants to make a PFS it's fine with me, I can make one for 30 cents. On the large picture slingshots are up for grabbs but only to a small percentage because of low interest in this sport/hobby and to some a complete waste of time. So have at it and make a PFS.


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## gamekeeper john (Apr 11, 2011)

dgui said:


> It's often said that imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.
> I've read quite a few posts on the topic of using one of our forum members' designs an modifying it to suit our orn personal taste. Does that make it custom then? Is it ethical to copy or customize another persons known design, as long as you're not trying to compete in selling and taking food off of their table?
> I ask this because I am new to the forum and found a deign that I really am impressed with, I built it to suit my needs better but the design remains obviously similar to a respected forum member.
> I truly did create a frame and it's not for sale, I would love to show it off to my friends here on the forum without being ostracized. I respect all of you to much and I appeciate the forum.


I

I don't know if any one relys on making and selling slingshots for a living. If someone is making and selling a particular design series I would consider it to be not within the law to copy and if you want to copy one that is being sold then buy it first. If anyone wants to make a PFS it's fine with me, I can make one for 30 cents. On the large picture slingshots are up for grabbs but only to a small percentage because of low interest in this sport/hobby and to some a complete waste of time. So have at it and make a PFS.
[/quote]

I think all the vendors on here rely on slingshots for making a living, I havn't had my own range out that long and i'm allready earning at least 3 times more a week than i could in most other jobs, its quiet easy to sell £200 worth of slingshots a day or even more, (thats only 10 of my frames) and to be honest i'v been averaging that now for a couple of months, then i'v got the one off designs, bandsets and stickshooters! it just makes me wonder what the others are earning, there frames are more expensive than mine and they probaly sell a lot more !!! I now fully rely on my cattys for a living, they pay for my house, the bills, and all the other things in life,


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## flippinout (Jul 16, 2010)

I rely primarily on slingshot crafting to support my family. My wife is a teacher, but they get paid less than farmworkers, so copying is definitely painful to the craftsman and artist.


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## dgui (Jan 12, 2010)

Had no idea that an individual could make so much money making and selling slingshots. Now thats incredible. Just think if a 3rd of the entire population went crazy for slingshots. Now I understand what the fuss was about with copying a designe. My mistake in judgment.


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## flippinout (Jul 16, 2010)

dgui said:


> Had no idea that an individual could make so much money making and selling slingshots. Now thats incredible. Just think if a 3rd of the entire population went crazy for slingshots. Now I understand what the fuss was about with copying a designe. My mistake in judgment.


"so much money" is a very relative term. The craftsman is limited by his ability to produce volume at high quality. Combine that with material cost, bands, marketing costs, tool costs, design time, etc. It is still a tight game. I would wager no one is making a strong living on slingshots- YET!!!

Our sport is growing daily.


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## bj000 (Jul 21, 2011)

first of all, i doubt any slingshot vendors are rich because they make slingshots.. they work hard to barely get by, or they are live relatively comfortable (probably working other jobs on the side). I don't agree with straight out copying designs to sell, however i don't believe adding a pinky hole to any design makes it copying.. Or a lanyard hole.. or any detail like that. those are functional design aspects that are interchangeable with any existing design, pretty much. but truth is that if you take a bit of design from a few different slingshots, then mash them up together then you can call it your own and sell it. there are only so many ways you can make a slingshot without making them inside out¿

for example i can make a song using the same musical notes that Beethoven uses in the 9th symphony , rearrange the notes and change the tempo and tada ! i made a new song.. 
works with design too. a pinky hole is just another note in the slingshot symphony . as is a palmswell, etc..

i dealt a lot with people copying my art style years ago.. in my experience when people liked what i did and then copied it , it forced me to think outside the box even more.. 
ahh nevermind.. i dont want to rant.


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