# Using Constrictor Knot on Pouch



## Talaman (Sep 13, 2019)

Morning all!

I recently changed to using a constrictor knot when tying bands for my small pouches when I use 8mm (5/16).

I am tying the knots as tight as I possibly can but now after a lot of use I note that they are allowing the band to slip through slightly which results in miss aligned bands on the pouch.















Has anyone out there experienced this and are their any known remedies please?

This is my first post with pics, so hope it works!


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## Sean Khan (Mar 27, 2020)

Constrictor knots are overrated. I don't use them any more for this reason.

The solution is to tie with elastic sting or something else thin and stretchy. And then tie cotton string over that with a surgeon's knot. You will not have any problems whatsoever after that.

Or... if you still want to use a constrictor knot, tie a square knot over that. It won't come loose then.

In my opinion however, without using stretchy string, you are just going up the creek without a paddle.

https://www.daraz.pk/products/elastic-thread-elastic-string-for-making-elastic-bracelets-i114224170-s1265960105.html?spm=a2a0e.searchlist.list.1.6cc64223oFH3Xx&search=1









Rubber bands will also work but those are kinda lousy and they would eventually turn into a gummy mess in my climate.


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## AUSSIE4 (Nov 21, 2019)

I use cotton twine. Cut the excess band off right next to the knot. Never had any slips in my life ever. Constrictor knots are quick and efficient. For this reason I have never switched to anything else.


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## Cjw (Nov 1, 2012)

All I've ever used is constrictor knots. Never had any problems.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## AUSSIE4 (Nov 21, 2019)

Cjw said:


> All I've ever used is constrictor knots. Never had any problems.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


Same they're a great knot. Never had and probably never will have any problems with them. Beats tying ribbon any day in my opinion.


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## Pebble Shooter (Mar 29, 2014)

I have never used string and constrictor knots to connect flat band ends to pouches, as I found that the old and proven method of wrapping and tucking thin rubber strips (usually band remnants) works extremely well since returning to homemade slingshots in 2012 - providing that the strips are held under constant tension while being wrapped around the folded band ends on the pouch prior to "tucking in" the ends.

Regular string does indeed work for many slingshot shooters, but I would assume that even a constrictor knot can loosen after a certain number of shots because of the relatively low friction surface of regular string, regardless of how tight the knot was tied. This is a problem generally not encountered with rubber strips.

In the last two years or so, I've been using Chinese rubber band tie string, and have had absolutely no issues with pouch ties loosening in any way. I should add that I use a homemade band mounting jig, which makes it easier to wrap the string and to tie a knot as opposed to tucking the string ends.

See here: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32980082759.html?spm=2114.12010612.8148356.3.207439d3fANvMe


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## AUSSIE4 (Nov 21, 2019)

Pebble Shooter said:


> I have never used string and constrictor knots to connect flat band ends to pouches, as I found that the old and proven method of wrapping and tucking thin rubber strips (usually band remnants) works extremely well since returning to homemade slingshots in 2012 - providing that the strips are held under constant tension while being wrapped around the folded band ends on the pouch prior to "tucking in" the ends.
> 
> Regular string does indeed work for many slingshot shooters, but I would assume that even a constrictor knot can loosen after a certain number of shots because of the relatively low friction surface of regular string, regardless of how tight the knot was tied. This is a problem generally not encountered with rubber strips.
> 
> ...


If you tie under tension the knot should never loosen. Some bands I cut a little longer for targets provided me with 1000+ shots and never had the knot slip. Maybe if you used something like waxed thread or something similar, then it would slip due to the material being too 'slippery.' Cotton twine holds a grip really well never had any problems with it. I used to use the little elastic strips however band life was horrible as there is too much friction on the bands which would wear them very quick. Some sets lucky to get 50 shots. Max I would get would be around 130-150 shots on a 'good' set. I always tie under tension and tie the knot directly next to the pouch.


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## Catapults and Carving (Jan 6, 2020)

I had a problem with this at first and I realised I needed to stretch the band more before tying the knot, it allowed me to get a tighter knot and stop any slip. 
Hope it helps mate ????????


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## cpu_melt_down (Mar 20, 2017)

I use waxed, cotton thread and I've only had this problem when I did not tighten the constrictor knot enough.

It looks like you are using some sort of synthetic string material.

Perhaps the "slickness" of this type material is allowing the slippage.

Also, when I first started using the constrictor knot, I tied it wrong sometimes and it came loose over time.


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## Island made (Aug 14, 2019)

Make sure your stretching the elastic before you tie the knot. I’ve done it this way for many years and have never had one slip or untie.


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## Sean Khan (Mar 27, 2020)

Pebble Shooter said:


> I use a homemade band mounting jig


This is the only tool I ever use... a surgical clamp. I can do everything with this darn thing. :rofl:

















And yes, use some kind of elastic string or rubber. Wrap and tuck or use a surgeon's knot and another square knot over that. Because my threads are very thin, I use many many wraps. And then cover it up with cotton string... also many many warps. Again, use a surgeon's knot and another square knot over that.

See here:









As you can see the cotton string is fraying. That's from the shock of shooting. If your ribbon/thread is smooth-slippy, your knot will be effected, no doubts there.

I use many turns of the thread because I'm afraid my strings will cut through the rubber.

If you want to use a constrictor knot, use a "double constrictor" knot (see google). Or finish it off with a square knot.

I never said it's a dreadful knot. I just said it's "meh" and unnecessary and awkward to tie. And it certainly does not work on polypropylene string (which I.. and many others... often use). Not on it's own. It will come loose, guaranteed. You need to finish it off with another knot.



> I would assume that even a constrictor knot can loosen after a certain number of shots because of the relatively low friction surface of regular string, regardless of how tight the knot was tied. This is a problem generally not encountered with rubber strips.


 :yeahthat: What he said.



> I've been using Chinese rubber band tie string, and have had absolutely no issues with pouch ties loosening in any way.


Yep. Looks similar to my elastic string. More of a ribbon though.

Nice.


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## Talaman (Sep 13, 2019)

WOW! What a great forum!

Thank you all for your prompt and useful replies. And thanks S.K for the video etc.

The material used for the knot may be the problem. I am using the "strings" that make up the inside of para chord as I saw that method recommended on a YouTube site. I agree, they may be slipping slightly.

I did use the Chinese "CRYSTAL" elastic thread/string and it did OK but the black dye seemed to come off the thread and impregnate the band. And once the band tore at that stained area and IIRC that is why I looked for an alternative method of attaching the bands. Furthermore, I agree I could/should perhaps stretch the elastic a bit more than I did.

Going to have a rethink, I will come back and add to the thread by letting you know how I progress.

Thank you all again for your input.


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## Quercusuber (Nov 10, 2011)

AUSSIE4 said:


> I use cotton twine. Cut the excess band off right next to the knot. Never had any slips in my life ever. Constrictor knots are quick and efficient. For this reason I have never switched to anything else.


All of the above :yeahthat:

Plus, I've found that cotton twine, opposed to rubbers strips (or other tying medium made out of rubber) makes bands last 3 times more.

From what I've seen in the pictures, your folding technique seems to be the problem. Perhaps you're not folding the bands properly when tying.

Best regards ...Q


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## Talaman (Sep 13, 2019)

Hi Quercusuber,

The pictures show how the bands have moved/slipped after or during the process of firing approx 300 shots. They were not like that at after my tying them - in the images, the knot has moved back on to the pouch and the shorter part of the band has slipped in to the position you now see.


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## AUSSIE4 (Nov 21, 2019)

Talaman said:


> WOW! What a great forum!
> 
> Thank you all for your prompt and useful replies. And thanks S.K for the video etc.
> 
> ...


No worries mate. I saw a similar video with paracord inner strands from Chris Graffin better known as 'Catapult Carnage'. I'd try cotton twine before you order anything else. Most general grocery stores sell them very cheap. I get an 100m one for something like $3.79 Aud. Lasts a very long time. Personally I don't like the Chinese crystal thread or ribbon. I can tie up a bandset with constrictor knots about 10x quicker and you get around the same band life.


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## Sean Khan (Mar 27, 2020)

Last time I use constrictor knots, was on this guy.

I used it to both attach the pouch and the bands to the frame. This slingshot is very powerful and the knots have not slipped one bit.

The string is polypropylene... or is it polyethylene?.... some bloody-poly string. Quite slippy.









As you can see, there is another knot on top of the constrictor knot. AND there is a wrap of elastic string under that... which you can't see. That is why it's still secure.









Why use poly string/ribbon? Because of long tube/band life. It's doesn't saw or cut into the bands under shock or tightening. Problem is, you have to be good with your knots or it will work itself loose.

Oh and a tip... don't tell anyone! Use a drop of super-glue on the knot (DO NOT drip on the rubber) if you think it's going to get undone. Even the stupidest knot will turn into super-knot. Unfortunately for me, super-glue doesn't work on poly-string. :rolling:


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## AUSSIE4 (Nov 21, 2019)

Sean Khan said:


> Last time I use constrictor knots, was on this guy.
> 
> I used it to both attach the pouch and the bands to the frame. This slingshot is very powerful and the knots have not slipped one bit.
> 
> ...


I used to shoot looped tubes. Using cotton constrictor knots on looped 1745. I would get around 700 shots before a small tear. Could expect 100 more till a breakage but I change everything when it gets a tear. I don't let anything get to breaking point. No need for all those knots and elastic on the tubes that would just make them slower than what they already are. Could be good as a bait chucker fishing.


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## Sean Khan (Mar 27, 2020)

> that would just make them slower


Why would an extra knot or two make it slower? Air resistance???

It's a slingshot mate. Not a Ferrari. :rofl:

All this talk of air resistance... I think it's negligible if you are shooting large hex-nuts. Only power matters then. And to deliver that power I would like to be a bit extra secure. I can do without the 2, 3, feet per second I would have saved if I cared about air-resistance or small pouches.



> Could be good as a bait chucker fishing.


I have no idea what that means. I don't hunt or fish. 



> I would get around 700 shots before a small tear.


This is an old slingshot.... well over a 1000 shots with this one. Still going strong.

Maybe because I store my rubber in a spare fridge....


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## Ibojoe (Mar 13, 2016)

I’ve used them all the way without incident. Never had one slip stretching the elastic and using butchers twine. Maybe your jig isn’t stretching it enough. But there was a thread like this years ago. Double check everything these guys suggested and you’ll be fine.


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## StringSlap (Mar 2, 2019)

I use amber tape now, but when I was using a constrictor, cotton butcher twine seemed to be best. Stretching the bands more before tying should stop the slipping.


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## Quercusuber (Nov 10, 2011)

Talaman said:


> Hi Quercusuber,
> 
> The pictures show how the bands have moved/slipped after or during the process of firing approx 300 shots. They were not like that at after my tying them - in the images, the knot has moved back on to the pouch and the shorter part of the band has slipped in to the position you now see.


Oh, I see ...

Well, the texture of the string itself might help (or not) the tie. I found that rough textures hold better the constrictor knot.

Besides, you can pre-stretch the bands before tying, but I suspect you already do that.

Most people here prefer rubber ties, but in my case, I've noticed that rubber on rubber creates a lot of friction, thus making bands tear faster.

Anyway, slingshots are always evolving. Experience with some band sets and record the results. You'll get to the sweet spot sooner or later 

Cheers ...Q


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## AUSSIE4 (Nov 21, 2019)

Sean Khan said:


> > that would just make them slower
> 
> 
> Why would an extra knot or two make it slower? Air resistance???
> ...


Okie dokie mate whatever floats your boat :thumbsup:


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## raventree78 (Apr 20, 2016)

One thing I would add is to make sure you are tieing a proper constrictor knot, I was tieing it wrong when I first started and had issues with slipping. once you get it down, use cotton twine and do it a few dozen times it will be second nature


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## Rayshot (Feb 1, 2010)

PRE STRETCH the bands before cinching the the knot close to the pouch as possible. It has already been mentioned. Do it. Problem solved.


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## Rayshot (Feb 1, 2010)

BTW. A constrictor knot is nearly a miracle of a knot! Pre stretching and a constrictor knot is nearly divine.


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## BushpotChef (Oct 7, 2017)

I use thin strips of rubber usually the end of the roll, about 5mm wide and 8cm long for the fork ties, 2.5mm wide & 5cm long for pouch ties.

This is approximate but fairly close, I also don't use constrictor knots or jigs. Every thing is hand tied with 3-4 winds and a double knot. Lube the tie a bit before each knot with some a little spit. Works excellent for me, good luck. 

Sent from my LM-X210APM using Tapatalk


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## Talaman (Sep 13, 2019)

Firstly, a *BIG* thank-you to everyone who has answered, I really appreciate your thoughts and help.

I have gone over several times in my mind what I did when I tied that pouch and what was in my mind at the time. What the majority of you have said, I feel is correct. So I am laying out my thought process:-

1. I was unhappy with the crystal string as mentioned above.

2. I watched the Chris Graffin (catapult carnage) video on constrictor knots - so chose the para chord string and chose to use a constrictor knot. I watched videos and practiced the knot many times.

3. I also watch an Asa (Romany Custom Catapults) video on the use of the constrictor knots and he did not use a jig so I opted to copy that method - probably not stretching the band enough.

4. Despite the slippage photographed at the start of this thread, the bands have lasted well. For me, probably the longest life of a band to date.

5. The next pouch I tie, I shall use decent twine AND stretch the band more.

I will let you know how get on.


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## Talaman (Sep 13, 2019)

OK, I am back!

Problem solved. As several people kindly pointed out, I was simply NOT stretching the band enough before tieing the pouch.

Did that, and added another knot as suggested by Sean no problems now thank you all so much. Additionally, I have scrounged some "Dyna Cable"fishing backing line that is SUPER strong and low stretch. Will try it out soon - just hope it does not cut in to the bands.

Thank you all once again!

Geoff out!


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## Konrad (May 2, 2020)

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but I just tried fly fishing back line (Braid) and it fails after twenty shots. Thick stuff too 80lb. 0.53mm. robbo told me to use cuffs, a thin strip of rubber under it and copydex to seal it up. I am going to use some 1mm crystal string, just waiting for it to arrive. ATO75 also warned me it would cut thru and it did.

Most people say to use waxed leather stitching cotton twine.

I got the info to use braid from Youtube


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## Tag (Jun 11, 2014)

Great video


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## cavedweller (Mar 10, 2015)

Best tie stuff I have used so far is "1mm stretch elastic" I got from the hobby area in a garden center. It's just a thin clear string made of something stretchy (latex of some sort I presume) and incredibly strong. I've used it on tubes, solid bands and flats. Best stuff ever on everything I have. Next best I've found is that Chinese flat band tying stuff you get on a spool.


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## Rayshot (Feb 1, 2010)

Konrad said:


> Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but I just tried fly fishing back line (Braid) and it fails after twenty shots. Thick stuff too 80lb. 0.53mm. robbo told me to use cuffs, a thin strip of rubber under it and copydex to seal it up. I am going to use some 1mm crystal string, just waiting for it to arrive. ATO75 also warned me it would cut thru and it did.
> 
> Most people say to use waxed leather stitching cotton twine.
> 
> I got the info to use braid from Youtube


I am after many years still baffled why people feel a need to do the extras for tying the pouch to the bands or tubes.

By extras I am referring to glue or cuffs on a knot.

Simple chalk line string, for example is a thin, strong string that binds well on itself, using a constrictor knot is all that is necessary.

I have been using chalk line string for years and it has been great.


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## Konrad (May 2, 2020)

Rayshot said:


> Konrad said:
> 
> 
> > Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but I just tried fly fishing back line (Braid) and it fails after twenty shots. Thick stuff too 80lb. 0.53mm. robbo told me to use cuffs, a thin strip of rubber under it and copydex to seal it up. I am going to use some 1mm crystal string, just waiting for it to arrive. ATO75 also warned me it would cut thru and it did.
> ...


Well well, I am honored and I think robbo would be too.

*Mr Bill Hayes, could you please put a link to the brand of chalk line that you use here in this thread*. I have heard there are different strengths of chord. The copydex is used instead of blobbing and to glue the cuffs. Cuffs extend the band life. Flatband uses nail polish and this is the alternative.

Kindest regards Paul.

p.s How did you go with that Mountain Lion?


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## Konrad (May 2, 2020)

I could not find it before

"I use a *Irwin chalk line string* that in relaxed state is about 1.25 - 1.33 mm and it never cuts my bands and I give the constrictor knot a strong pull to cinch up the knot.

I am curious to know where this fear of "cutting" the latex comes from? I have never seen any of my latex cut from the string. I wonder if someone confused the tearing of the bands near the pouch, with the latex just being stressed to the breaking point, either from too much stretch or just wearing out. " Rayshot.

It must be this one, the cotton because the braid cuts.

https://www.irwin.com/tools/marking-tools/replacement-lines

https://slingshotforum.com/topic/41206-constrictor-knot-comparisons/?p=509995

Regards PK.


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## Rayshot (Feb 1, 2010)

Konrad said:


> I could not find it before
> 
> "I use a *Irwin chalk line string* that in relaxed state is about 1.25 - 1.33 mm and it never cuts my bands and I give the constrictor knot a strong pull to cinch up the knot.
> 
> ...


Thanks Konrad.

I mentioned the relaxed state. When taught and cinched it is minimal for a strong string, easy to manipulate.

I haven't use the dewalt string (which Home depot has switched to from the irwin), because I bought several packages of the 100ft Irwin. So I still have a lot of the Iwin on hand. Though, I am confident the Dewalt string is good. It has to be able handle the stress of being stretched to strike chalk lines.


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## SJAaz (Apr 30, 2019)

As mentioned by someone above, the only trouble with tying bands on I've had is when I stretch the rubber strips too tight. I use bees wax on butcher's twine and have never had a failure with the constrictor knot. I used to use a clove hitch with an overhand knot on the top and never had a failure, but the constrictor makes a neater finish.


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## robbo (Jun 8, 2019)

irwin hi-tensile replacement line is cotton apparently . part no 1932894 it looks like black and white its the only irwin one i can find around here, does anyone no if its ok to use it . its cotton for a chalk line, why would they have cotton and hi-tensile cotton


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## Konrad (May 2, 2020)

My apologies Ray Bozonski, some how I got you mixed up with Bill Hayes. I don't know how I did that, *must be all your badges*. I don't drink or take drugs. Any way I would love to reverse engineer your pouches, not to sell just for personal use.

Here you are man, talking to Nathan masters.






Great to see you on the forum. Kindest regards Paul.K

p.s Use G100 grade ball bearings over 12 yards. Best wishes to Nathan Masters, I hope he is ok.


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