# Powerful version of a kids toy?



## abwurfgrenni (Nov 28, 2010)

Hey guys

im having an idea in my mind but i cant really find the right way how to do the rubber part. So i thought i might ask you.
I´m thinking about making a powerful version of an old kids toy. I don´t know what it is called, therefore i wasn´t able to properly use the search function of the forum, so forgive me if this has already been discussed somewhere.
Its made out of a piece of pipe an on one end there is a ballon or the cut of finger of a rubberglove taped on. If you want to use it, you drop the ammo from the front end into the pipe grab the rear end of the ballon with the ammo pull it and release it. Than the ammo flies through the pipe out of the front end. It has no seperate pouch the pouch is created by the ballon itself.
You understand what i mean?

My questions are now:
- what could be used as rubber (i think something like a rubberhose with an inner diameter of 20+ mm is needed)?
- does anyone has experience with that?
- do you guys think its possible / useful / makes sense?

Thanks


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## Charles (Aug 26, 2010)

abwurfgrenni said:


> Hey guys
> 
> im having an idea in my mind but i cant really find the right way how to do the rubber part. So i thought i might ask you.
> I´m thinking about making a powerful version of an old kids toy. I don´t know what it is called, therefore i wasn´t able to properly use the search function of the forum, so forgive me if this has already been discussed somewhere.
> ...


Yep ... I was just playing with this recently ... did not have a lot of success. I was using PVC pipe. I tried latex glove fingers, baby bottle nipples, and condoms. (Just imagine the looks I got when I asked a clerk for non-lubicated condoms ... seems they do not make non-lubricated condoms these days, at least the local shops do not carry them.) After playing around with it a bit, I decided it was not worth the bother. But maybe you will have more success.

Cheers ...... Charles


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## watcher by night (Jun 14, 2010)

Abwurfgrenni,

It actually is a pretty powerful "toy" for propelling light pellets like .177 BBs. I used to cut the fingers off of the kind of rubber gloves you wear for dish-washing. Then I cut a short piece of conduit and used a plastic tie to clamp the glove finger on to the conduit. It had a much shorter draw than any of the slingshots I had back then, but would shoot a BB much faster than any of my slingshots. The finger life was quite a bit shorter than my band life for my "conventional" slings. I never did try shooting anything larger than BBs.

I wonder how a rubber shower cap would work? It would probably be strong enough to launch some fairly heavy projectiles. You'd need a large diameter loop or tube for mounting it.


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## mattardel (May 27, 2011)

I absolutely loved making these a couple of years back. They were quite powerful, and could shoot a variety of ammo. I made them using both 3/4 and 1 inch diameter PVC pipes of various lengths, from one inch to 4 feet. Length really doesn't affect accuracy, it's comfort that matters. For me, the best were around 6 inches long to a foot long. It doesn't matter because the projectile never touches the barrel. I used both balloons and rubber bands taped with either duct or electrical tape wrapped around the ends many times. Rubber bands last far longer and are good for heavy ammo. I even used pencils, which could shoot through thin (1/16 in thick) steel plates. This had no range accuracy, however. Using balloons to shoot bbs is the best idea. They have very low life as you have to grip the balloon by the bb and it tears fast, within a couple dozen shots. I did get them to shoot spherical candies about 150 yards using the rubber bands.


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## bullseyeben! (Apr 24, 2011)

We used to call em glove guns..


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## Imperial (Feb 9, 2011)

i know exactly what you mean. this was the first type of slingshot i used to make as a kid. id cut the top off of a plastic soda bottle or a milk gallon, then id get one of those 2 inch party balloons that use helium, and id just open it up and put it over the threads on the plastic. the threads hold it on, another thing that helps if id roll the opening of it a bit to the body of the balloon to get rid of the neck on the balloon. i used to shoot lil china berries and small marbles. rocks or any jagged ammo will tear up the balloon. the way i would shoot these was to make an o.k. sign with your hand, with your palm facing you. just rest the bottle top in the "O" and load up and shoot. once in a long while ill make one just for personal nostalgia sakes. when you cut the top, make sure you leave some plastic below the bottles threaded opening, itll serve as a form of grip. hmm.... i wonder how a condom would work on this instead of a helium party balloon.


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## Henry the Hermit (Jun 2, 2010)

mattardel said:


> I even used pencils, which could shoot through thin (1/16 in thick) steel plates.


OK, guys, a tall tale now and then never hurt anybody, but I ain't buying this claim. Armor piercing pencils? I doubt even McGyver could make that believable.


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## mattardel (May 27, 2011)

Henry in Panama said:


> I even used pencils, which could shoot through thin (1/16 in thick) steel plates.


I should probably clarify. I was using the extra thick "learning pencils" (about 2.5x a thick as regular ones) and they did not go clean through, but did make a hole through to the other side. Not very high quality steel, but steel nonetheless. If you use multiple layers of thick bands on a heavy, pointed object, it will have enough momentum to pierce.

OK, guys, a tall tale now and then never hurt anybody, but I ain't buying this claim. Armor piercing pencils? I doubt even McGyver could make that believable.
[/quote]


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## abwurfgrenni (Nov 28, 2010)

hey guys,
thanks for the replys. I was thinking about this subject and this morning i also had the idea of using condoms for that. They have already been proofen to make good slingshot bands. I thought maybe i have to double them up (maybe 5, maybe 10 pieces, needs to be tested). My idea would be you "borrow" one of your girlfriends "toys"







, than you put a small (plastik)ball (maybe airsoft ammo) in to it and roll it over the toy. In that way you should have the ball sitting in the tip of the condom. Now you pull the other condoms over the first one (one by one). After you have pulled them all over each other you take a thin piece of cord or rubber a wrap it thightly around the condoms directly under the ball so that the ball is "trapped" in the end. I think this would help to keep the condoms together in the end and prevent them from sliding appart.
About the condoms i´m not quite sure if it would be better to use lubricated ones or none lubricated ones. The none lubricated ones mitght have a better "grip" on the pipe and might be less likley to slip off. the lubricated ones might have the advantage that (if u are using "doubled up" condoms) there is less friction between them wich might give the hole thing a better performance.
About the accuracy i think it might help if one would add a T-handle like on some "hawaiian slings", or a tonfa but with a bearing or so, so that the pipe can turn freely and is always aligned with the ammo.
If you are using only a pipe (without side handle) and a very powerfull set of "bands" it might be a good thing to have a pipe with some kind of "collar" in the front end to prevent slipping through your hand.
What i like in these things is that they are very easy to make, they can be very compact, you can store and carry them loaded around in your pocket, its easier/faster to load and i think its a very good thing for shooting shot (from BB size to "Buck shot")
You could even make them out of a pill bottle with cut of bottom. In this way you can load it put the cap on and carry/store it. If you want to shoot just pop off the cap and you are ready to go.









Another question would be. What would be better, a regular version or an "inverted" version, where you fix the the condoms in front of the pipe an pull the condoms through the pipe to shoot?


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## Jacktrevally (Feb 14, 2011)

1\16 is 1.5mm thick steel sheets.

I use 0.75mm thick flat/ round corrugated steel sheeting with strength of 250Mpa which is weak comapred to others. We use 0.75mm to build engineered canopies resisting winds of 300km/h.

If you can pierce just a little through that it is impressive, let alone denting it with a pencil is very impressive!

I can't even do that with a 6.5-9mm steel balls with a 4 strand 2050. Just tried that in my garden!


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## Jacktrevally (Feb 14, 2011)

Take 2, No way I could bent that with a 30in draw with 2050 tubes.

http://postimage.org/image/1uispqo6c/

8.8 grade Hex nut, 6.5mm bolt diameter. Multiply by 1.5 to get the external size of the bolt, they are engineered grade bolt which you find in specialist stores. I have a few 10.9 grade use in highly engineering stuctures rated to 700mpa.


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## mattardel (May 27, 2011)

The steel was not anywhere near that quality however, it was a small box not meant to withstand extreme conditions. I guess my point was just that these rubber-powered shooters have quite a bit of power in them. And I have created some in the t-pipe model, and also others in various different designs using PVC connecters. I still think the original one-pipe design is the best, as it allows for the best grip on the pipe.


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## bootneck (Feb 20, 2011)

we called them jonny rockets, a lad in collage killed a rat with one too, well he told me he did anyway, surely there must be a good way like making a cone from theraband by glueing with the glue for mending punctures on bike innertubes, and making it like that, also it would be tapered as a cone so fast too


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## abwurfgrenni (Nov 28, 2010)

Hi,
the problem with bike innertubes is, that the ones available where i live are not usable as slingshot bands. They are nearly non-elastic. Otherwise a hosetype like that would be fine.
I thought about maybe producing something like that myself. The idea is to take an cylindrical object with a rounded buttend (maybe broom handle or cigar case) and dip it into liquid latex.

Edit: Sorry i misread your post a little bit. I already thought about glueing theraband into a tube, but i think this would have two disadvantages.
First, i don´t think the innertube glue is as elastic as theraband is, wich would decrease the ability of the band to stretch.
Second, you would have to double the band up to a certain ammount in the area of glueing. This would make the band "stronger" / Harder to pull in that preticular area. Wich would lead to a inconsitence in "draw weight" on one side and the other of the "hose". I believe this might have an negative impact on the performance.


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## abwurfgrenni (Nov 28, 2010)

@bootneck
i really like your idea with the tapered cone, didn´t think of that before.
Maybe it would be possible to take a tapered (metal)pin and "paint" it with or dip it into liquid latex.
Maybe this way the last part of the tip could be "reinforced" by applying two "layers" of latex to reduce wear while beeing used as the pouch.


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## bootneck (Feb 20, 2011)

could it be possible to make lots of strips of theraband and just spot glue them together into a cone? that'll solve having a stiffer area on just one side, plus before you go cutting up expensive theraband up you could test the concept with cheap elastic bands, because it wouldnt matter too much if theres gaps only that they all meet at the bottom to make a sort of built in pouch, if it works with rubber bands you could taper the theraband quite drastically so they all meet and there will be less gaps.

I hope that makes sense, basically if you made a bunch of very tapered bands and spot glued them together it would make a cone shape.


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## bootneck (Feb 20, 2011)

or even condoms within condoms, im imagining about 5 condoms all inside each other then a elastic band tightly tied around the teat to keep them all together, plus if you make a few the people at the shop will think your a legend, getting through 20 condoms a week ;-)


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## abwurfgrenni (Nov 28, 2010)

the idea with the "doubled up" condoms i already had in one of my earlier comments on that topic








but today i came up with another possible idea, maybe using latexgloves wich also cover the forearm. cutting the "sleeve" off and tying them together at the end


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## Nico (Sep 10, 2010)

We used to call those "Tira lilas" in Mexico cos for fun we'd shoot green berries from the Lila Tree.

But they are still pretty strong and some kids call them "resorteras caseras" or home slingshot.

We made them basically the same with plastic milk jug necks and strong balloons, you can shoot pea gravel and small bbs, I saw my brother kill a pigeon with this basic balloon slingshot and a .177 bb on a 2 story roof he hit the neck/throat.

Another guy said that to make them stronger at that time circa late 1970s he used the punch baloons and the necks of the old large clorox bottles. They have a limit to projectile weight.

I once found a commercial one in the 1980s with a pistol grip and peep hole aimer with a thick latex condom like tip to shoot 6mm steelies sold by a knife vendor in a "swap meet" and it went into and through the cans at 10 yards, I killed a few English Sparrows with it.

Just my









Hope it helps
Nico


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## abwurfgrenni (Nov 28, 2010)

do you have a picture of that "punch Balloons" ? i have no clue what they look like.

Edit: found ´em was already looking at them some time ago, but did not tested them yet


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## Charles (Aug 26, 2010)

You might try the long balloons that clowns and magicians use to make baloon figures.

Cheers ....... Charles


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## abwurfgrenni (Nov 28, 2010)

Charles said:


> You might try the long balloons that clowns and magicians use to make baloon figures.
> 
> Cheers ....... Charles


thanks cool idea


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## Nico (Sep 10, 2010)

Like I said even the basic Tira Lilas can kill birds with head shots, just use smooth 1/4 pea gravel up to pigeon size will drop to a head shot, but I'd say stick with close range shots with these classic alternative slingshots. 

There are other bag shaped thick elastics (latex) out there ( even Mel's ball bladder idea comes to mind) I will look into it as this is also a project I left on the back burner some months ago. Would be cool to see it become more powerful than the original model. 

Good Luck
Nico


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