# Do smaller pouches = more accuracy?



## Jacob Smalley (Mar 18, 2014)

I did a search both here and Google and didn't see anything relevant. I ask because it seems logical that a smaller pouch would mean less ammo movement in the pouch and thus more repeat-ability.


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## M.J (Nov 1, 2010)

Up to a point, I suppose. 
If given the choice between too small and too large I would pick the pouch that's a little bigger than I usually shoot. When I use one smaller than about 2.5" x .75" my accuracy suffers and I feel like I spend more time fumbling around trying to get the ammo where I want it.


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## Henry the Hermit (Jun 2, 2010)

Smaller, lighter pouch = more velocity and less handslap.


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## Northerner (Nov 9, 2010)

I like 2 5/8" to 2 3/4" in length.. and 3/4" to 7/8" in width. This works great for 3/8" ammo. For dedicated .177cal BB shooters I will go smaller.


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## jazz (May 15, 2012)

I have noticed that I have more pleasant experience with a pouch that is somewhat narrower (I do not speak length here) than those that I used previously, just enough that my fingers touch the leather and not the ammo, and not much more than that.

Pleasant in this case means weaker or no hand slap, probably because of less weight..

I have also tried shorter pouches (I mean when you spread the pouch flat on the table, its length) but it does not work so well because the knots where the rubber is tied for the pouch touch my fingers and it makes me nervous and also contributes to less precision.

my experience..

cheers,

jazz


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## libel (Jul 1, 2013)

If you leave out the extremes, that is too small or too big, then I think accuracy is pretty much the same provided you center your ammo. I agree with MJ above. I would choose more pouch/ammo contact than necessary than less pouch/ammo contact than necessary.


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## jazz (May 15, 2012)

Hi all,

Reading back all said above I just had another thought.

As we have seen in many ocasion here, accuracy depends on many things but I would like to remind us that the speed of the projectile also plays a role, at least for the vertical component of precision: lower speed of a given amo is responsible for its larger drop than the (same) faster amo and at the same distance.

When we shoot our ammunition - whether glass, steel, lead, stone etc. ALL our weights are basicaly in tiny measurements, in grams - some 4,5,7,10 etc grams. And as we all know the same slingshot banded in a given way will send ammo of different weight at different speed(s).

And if ammo weight plays significant role related to the speed, then the pouch and the ties do it as well: all three of them have to be accelerated with the same bandset, that is, using the same power of the rubbers and, of course, the same draw, so they simply add up to the total weight which I think that we call here "dead weight".

In that sense, if "smaller" pouch menas smaller then some other design in the same material, then, yes, it does = accuracy (at least one aspect of it). But there is another aspect, then, which contributes to the speed/accurycy relation, and it would be a pouch made of a lighter material.

And finaly, as a third aspect, "smaller" pouch means less air resistance..

I think that it has already been proven that design/shape of the pouch plays significant role in air resistance.

To bring this line of thought to absurdity, maybe, I think that even the type of the material and its surface should play a role: material A and material B, other elements fixed, will have different air resistance. Remember that Olimpics in which (was it Australian") swimmers had these new wwimming suits designed after sharks skin, having considerably better results?

For those who are not after ultimate precision, this is not an issue at all. (Actualy, in my imagination I cherish ultimate precision, but in practice I belong here).

For the others, either because it is their breed or maybe slinghsots are their business which simply has to be competitive, for them everything matters or might matter: size, weight, shape, resistance, whatever.

If this is so in cars, airplanes, dish washing detergents, rifles/bullets and knives: more, faster, better, more economic, efficient etc- EVEN for a tiny edge - why not, then in slingshots too?

just couple of thoughts, but not completely sure about them..

cheers,

jazz


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## libel (Jul 1, 2013)

jazz said:


> [..]
> 
> just couple of thoughts, but not completely sure about them..
> 
> [..]


You're mistaken. When are you more accurate, when you drive 30 mph or when you drive 130 mph? When is your car more efficient? As long as the drop is constant it does not matter if it's 2 inches or 5.

Obviously the window of speeds in which each one is accurate is different but it does not necessarily mean that shooting at 175 fps is less accurate than 375 fps.


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## Jacob Smalley (Mar 18, 2014)

Excellent points all around. The thing I was thinking about was I got some pouches from Bill Hays and they are ok. But I just dont like the feel of them, on the outside. Now I have one from some Trumark RRT's that I really like the feel all around. Its a thinner more flexible leather, but its a bit to big.

Now I know that it depends a lot on your ammo as well. So I was thinking about moving to only .38 steel shot or so. And that way I could have only the size pouch necessary. I was also thinking about getting one of those Chief AJ pouches for arrows or balls. But I am unsure if the dimensions are to big for .38.


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## Northerner (Nov 9, 2010)

libel said:


> jazz said:
> 
> 
> > [..]
> ...


In my limited experience, there comes a point when more velocity makes accuracy easier* for me* to achieve. Last summer I spent some time shooting an 8" metal disc at 30 and 40 yards. With 190fps my 3/8" steel ball had a very loopy trajectory and accuracy was a big challenge. At 40 yards the ball was coming down on the gong at quite an angle and I couldn't hit it at all. With 250fps with the same frame I could hit the gong more times that missing. The ball was shooting much flatter and accuracy was much easier to achieve. Slight miscalculations on elevation did not have the same drastic affect as with the slower moving ball.

At 10 metres I did not find much accuracy difference between 190fps and 250fps. The trajectories were flat enough that slight miscalculations in frame position did not have a drastic affect on POI.


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## NaturalFork (Jan 21, 2010)

I have found that too small of a pouch is bad for ME at least. It seems to create more flier shots. I used to make my own pouches. Now I just buy them through simple shot or guys on this forum. They are cheap and perfect.


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## filipino_saltik (Oct 7, 2011)

just my 2 cents pouch is a very big part in accuracy the way you release and the way you hold your pouch so its more on the size that what you fill fits your hand better. generally i go as small as possible without sacrificing integrity of the pouch material and if i can i wanted to use an identical pouch every time.


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## jazz (May 15, 2012)

libel said:


> You're mistaken. When are you more accurate, when you drive 30 mph or when you drive 130 mph?


Hi libel, I think that cars and slingshots are completely opposite examples: with car, looking at it as a projectile, you want to miss the target, not to hit it - unless one wants to commit a suicide; sorry but this does not prove to me anything.



libel said:


> As long as the drop is constant it does not matter if it's 2 inches or 5.


There! - this is the right one: for you it does not matter, for me it does. Especialy at longer distances - and for slingshots and for some people those distances start probabbly at some 20 m and on: 30, 40 50 meters is a lot for a slingshot and the drop is not in centimeters but in tens, even meters as you go up. So, if for you it does not matter if the drop is 2 inches or 5 - which by analogy means for some longer distances 20 or 50 inches, then I must say, and without any sarcasm, that you are simply an exceptional person and I am ready to accept it and respect it. I just want to add one technical thing: at least for me, more I have to compensate more difficult the shot becomes for me and with worse results.

Maybe we come from two different groups of people: one is like you and the other is like me. Northerner above thinks similar to me, some other people maybe think similar to you which in slingshots is probably the most beautiful thing: differences.

But to close this thread within thread, reading back my comment, the long one, I think that I did not put enough effort into saying that it only represents my opinion based on some small set od data that come from my personal, limited experience, and not and not a firm statement for which I would be ready to die for.

Therefore, I see it as my fault and I am sorry for this.

cheers,

jazz


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## gbeauvin (Mar 7, 2014)

Along the same lines, how many of you use a hole in the pouch to help center the ammo, and do you find this affects your accuracy?

-GB


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## gbeauvin (Mar 7, 2014)

Oh, and if that was to hijackish then please let me know and I'll start a new thread on that topic!

-GB


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## Jacob Smalley (Mar 18, 2014)

I use a hole for ammo centering. It helps on larger pouches especially.


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