# Band draw weight?



## azmark

For newbie practice to work on form, what draw weight would you recommend? The Trumark I own has red tubular bands and they are too much for repeated draws to an anchor point. I am getting another slingshot anyway because the design feels unnatural.

How can I tell what the draw weight will be for any particular tube/band I try?


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## Btoon84

Those red tubes are too beefy for my liking. You'll be amazed once you shoot some Theraband gold flats. Or even some tex tubes... or even.... Some plain latex. The way to know what the draw weight on everything is, to buy some and test it out. Rehabilitation places and nursing homes sometimes will give you an arm length of Theraband green or blue (depending in what they have) for free. They don't stock gold. Or black. Black is nice. Just do some reading around in the bands/tubes section. There are plenty of opinions about good tubes. I'm not much of a tube guy.


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## Charles

Don't forget just plain old office rubber bands. Alliance Sterling 105s or 107s work just fine and are not too heavy. Or you can chain #64 rubber bands, and they will work fine.

Cheers .... Charles


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## hoggif

It would help a lot if you told a bit about what type of slingshot you're going to get (if you want tips for the yet unknown new slingshot). Chinese style ones are good for thin tubes. Some models with bend fork ends need heavy singles. Some models are dedicated to flats only. Then there are multi-type capable slingshots too. Type of ammo would be a helpfull hint too to get an idea of the power you need.

For small tubes I'd just try out perhaps 2040 and 1745. Cut some pseudotapers, looped and singles to get an idea quickly. Next time you'll know better if you should have ordered 1842 and/or 2050 instead. You may also prefer one over other based on other factors like how easy you find to attach them etc.

For flats some latex or theraband gold should give you an idea quickly too. Cut a couple widths to get on the right region and adjust from there more. If you find fork wide bands too easy, add more layer by doubling them. Something like 20/15mm tapers of TBG doubled could be a good starting point for a medium size ammo.

For single large tubes a selection of Theraband tubes could be tried out. You cannot get lighter than Yellow (tan is small if you need large tubes) and the heavy ones like black might be too much. Perhaps pieces of yellow, red or green has one that feels proper. If you're a small thin person like me, you may want to skip trying out green in the beginning, especially if you're trying to find a comfortable one for practice.

Estimating the draw weight depends on many parameters like tube type/width of flat, tapering or pseudotapering, looping or doubling/tripling/.. as well as amount of scretch. If you're unsure of the proper lenght, just make it too long and keep reattaching and cutting it shorter untill you've got the idea which worked well. This can have a huge effect because too short tubes can quicky get very heavy.

I like small tubes because it is easy to change. I use quite light tubes with small ammo for long plinking and heavier ones with larger ammo for short sessions only to avoid getting tired. I tend to shoot both in the same session with the ligher ones dominating.

To give you some numbers, here's some examples. I seem to like something like 10-12lbs or less pull for easy ones. I can get rougly there with eg. single Theratube yellow (20cm) or Theraband gold (22cm lengt of 20/10 taper doubled on each side). Doubled 2040 is probably on the upper region of the range. I can get almost there (rough estimate perhaps about 8-10lbs) with a similar lenght of 1842/1745 1:1 pseudotaper. At this lenght I find full looped 1745 on each side a too heavy and 19cm of TBG 25/15mm doubled seems too much to me. Theraband black doubled at 20/15mm taper is again perhaps at around 10lbs or so. Theraband red tube at 19cm lenght (singles) gives me about 18lbs which is considerably more than yellow at 20cm (and I find 18lbs quite unconfortable). My draw lenght is about 90cm or so which gives you some idea about the scretch.

How much does the draw weight affect? Depends a lot on the person. I can plink all day wit 8lbs and 10-12lbs is ok for practising but the accuracy is already compromised at first shot with 20lbs. On another person 20lbs might be just right perhaps. That's why I suggest trying out some combinations at the beginning to get an idea what suit you.

Perhaps these threads give you more idea. You may perhaps estimate that for the same lenght and draw, weight is more or less relational to the cross section area of the tubes. (not that simple with pseudotapers or tapered flat though):

http://slingshotforum.com/topic/13848-dankung-tube-sizes-explained/

http://slingshotforum.com/topic/39-thera-band-and-tube-resistance-elongation-chart/

Optimizing for speed/power on the comfortable range is another task that is going to be a lot more complicated than getting a good comfortable one.


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## Imperial

if your just starting, then it will be a bit hard to pull. especially if your starting

with a non brace slingshot. your hand, wrist, and arm strength on your slingshot

holding arm need to get used to the pull and the arm pulling the pouch also has to

develop some strength. do as charles said, get yourself some office bands, loop them

together and just pull on them for some strength building.


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## azmark

Responses to hoggif and general clarification:

I'm a bit overwhelmed with all the available slingshot designs, band or tube types, shooting styles, etc. I'm intrigued by the bands since I had never seen them until a few days ago. I don't know what a Chinese style slingshot is, so I haven't considered it. I'll research it some more. I'm going to look for something that I can use for both hammer style and the finger/thumb styles I have been seeing in videos.

The type of ammo I want to use is whatever is cheap and easy to get.


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## azmark

Charles said:


> Don't forget just plain old office rubber bands. Alliance Sterling 105s or 107s work just fine and are not too heavy. Or you can chain #64 rubber bands, and they will work fine.
> 
> Cheers .... Charles


I just looked up those rubber bands. They seem awfully skimpy for a slingshot. What am I missing?


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## Imperial

azmark said:


> I just looked up those rubber bands. They seem awfully skimpy for a slingshot. What am I missing?


have a quick look over . . .

http://slingshotforum.com/topic/23233-alternative-bands/

http://slingshotforum.com/topic/22854-chain-band-strength/?p=280234


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## Charles

Office rubber bands are a lot more powerful than you might think. It all depends on their preparation. I have shot about 10 qualifying scores for Power Rangers, and ALL but two were done using office rubber bands. Just peruse this thread:

http://slingshotforum.com/topic/21108-power-rangers/

In fact I shot the third highest qualifying score of anyone so far: 43.42 foot pounds.

http://slingshotforum.com/topic/21109-slingshot-forum-300-club/

I do not suggest that you should try to use office rubber bands for maximum power since you are just starting out. What I am saying is that you will be able to find office rubber bands cheaply just about anywhere. If you can get locally, or order on-line (from Amazon, for example) Alliance Sterling 105s or 107s, then all you have to do is take two, cut them so each is one strip, and presto! you have your bands. The alternative is to chain or braid some #64s, as they will also be fine for you to begin with.

Cheers ..... Charles


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## hoggif

I used term "chinese style slingshot" to make a difference on the slingshots that use looped tubes only (like the one on my avatar) instead of single straight tubes that you push over the fork ends like you do with Trumarks. There are other mounting methods like ball in the tube also

The main difference is wheather you need advice on large tubes like on Trumarks where something like Theraband tube is possible (inner diameter about 5mm and outer diameter more). Small looped tubes can like chinese 1745 (1.7mm inner diameter and 4.5mm outer) cannot be push over something like Trumark fork ends. The other difference is of couse the draw weight. With a looped tube you have two tubes to draw on each side (small tube ok) and for singles they are not doubled and heavier tube is ok.

Here's couple random examples of combination types that enable you to use looped tubes as well as flat bands:

http://www.simple-shot.com/collections/slingshots-flippinout/products/maxim-tactical-polymer

http://www.dankung.com/emart/agile-toucan-the-first-small-size-global-dankung-slingshot-p-395.html

I think you need to select the type of sligshot first to get more specific advice on banding it. The point with my numbers above is that on either one you can get to a same weight that is not overly stiff. With either one you are able to get it heavier too.

If you are intrested to try out different types a combination type may be nice to try out (unless you want to get different types just to try them out).


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## Henry the Hermit

Charles said:


> In fact I shot the third highest qualifying score of anyone so far: 43.42 foot pounds.


For the benefit of those new to slingshots, that is a very impressive accomplishment, especially for a (ahem!) senior citizen. To put it into perspecive, most mass produced slingshots are doing good to hit 15 lb/ft of energy.


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## azmark

Hoggif, what brand is the ss in your avatar, and is it designed to be used with different grip styles?

What recommendations does anyone have for a combination type slingshot? I can't see anything locally because no one carries anything but the wrist rocket style. I'll have to just look on the Internet. What I've seen so far indicates that the bottom of the line models will run me at least $30 plus shipping. Is that about right?


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## studer1972

Charles: Are the alliance pure crepe gold any better, or should I go with the sterling?

azmark: buy one from one of your local makers. I'm pretty happy with my PocketPredator polymer Ranger. It was just $20 and can shoot very nicely.


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## hoggif

The one on my avatar is http://www.dankung.com/emart/ergonomicdancing-dankung-hunting-slingshot-p-211.html. It is also a curvy model which can limit available grip styles.

My avatar model in my hand is pretty small and available grips is limited.





  








Ergonomic(Dancing) dankung hunting slingshot




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hoggif


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Jun 5, 2013




The scale below has1cm squares






Let's scale it up a bit..




  








Two Dankungs




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hoggif


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Jun 5, 2013




The scale below has1cm squares

Dankung ergonomic dancing vs Dankung polished pocket thunder






For holding hammer gripped when scaled up? :what: Techically yes, but not comfortable. Better get a slingshot that suits the shooting style you intend to use.




  








Polished pocket thunder




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hoggif


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Jun 5, 2013




Dankung polished pocket thunder on 1cm square grid.

This one is huge. Let's see.. you're...






The only combination one I have is Toucan that I linked earlier. I've dedicated it for the flatbands. I'll let people that have more of those to compare with recommend these.

With about $30 + shipping you start getting choises on all categories. Whatever you get, I'd avoid the cheap eBay crap that probably just injures you.


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## Charles

studer1972 said:


> Charles: Are the alliance pure crepe gold any better, or should I go with the sterling?
> 
> azmark: buy one from one of your local makers. I'm pretty happy with my PocketPredator polymer Ranger. It was just $20 and can shoot very nicely.


The crepe bands are not very good ... they have a lower latex content. The sterling line from Alliance has the highest latex content.

Cheers .... Charles


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## studer1972

Thanks Charles! Saved me from buying the wrong rubber bands again.


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## azmark

studer1972 said:


> Charles: Are the alliance pure crepe gold any better, or should I go with the sterling?
> azmark: buy one from one of your local makers. I'm pretty happy with my PocketPredator polymer Ranger. It was just $20 and can shoot very nicely.


I'll have to see if anyone close to me makes them. I'm kind of remote.


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## studer1972

Bill Hays/Pocket Predator in Texas or Perry Adkisson/A+ of California are relatively close if you don't know of one nearer. Both have great reputations, and I love my Pocket Predator Ranger, just $20 bands included.


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## azmark

It turned out we had Alliance Sterling 107s at my office. Those things are tough. I took one and put one end over my thumb and pinched the other end and drew it. I could only pull about 18 inches and it wouldn't come any further back. It felt like if I pulled any harder it might have broken. Maybe I was just afraid of it snapping back on me, I don't know.


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## azmark

The next day I got to wondering how the 107s would behave as straight bands rather than as a loop. I cut two of them, held them together pinched at both ends. I was easily able to draw back with extra to spare. I'm certain this is a well-known phenomenon here, but how is it that the single rubber band would only stretch a few inches but two cut into straight bands stretch easily over twice as far?


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## trobbie66

azmark said:


> Hoggif, what brand is the ss in your avatar, and is it designed to be used with different grip styles?
> 
> What recommendations does anyone have for a combination type slingshot? I can't see anything locally because no one carries anything but the wrist rocket style. I'll have to just look on the Internet. What I've seen so far indicates that the bottom of the line models will run me at least $30 plus shipping. Is that about right?


check out Nathan at Simple Shot. An Axiom polymer is a good price, easy to changeup grips and will support different tube or band setups. Also ,unless you toss it in a fire ,it is indestructible. A grest catty to experiment with.


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## Jeff Lazerface

RAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!! As a rookie, TBG and the TBG calculator are one of my favorite things. Its like having a gun with adjustable ammo! I plan on messing with tubes next month.


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