# Update! -- Tubemaster FlatCat



## Byudzai (Aug 31, 2013)

I've always been intrigued by Bill's Tubemaster Sniper, so simple and clean and rugged-looking, and as I was drawing a mule up for Kev in CAD, so he could do waterjet, I wondered if I could trace one out for myself too. I never did learn how to tie a proper tubeset, so I added my fork tips to the frame to cater to my laziness. Hard to know if the two ideas will blend well in the Real World but I look forward to trying it. I'll have my waterjet guy cut one from 1/2" G10 and finish it up to show you guys.










=-=-=-=-=-=

Well here is a roughed out draft in whatever plastic Dave had lying around his waterjet shop. I can see why people like this frame so much!


----------



## Arnisador78 (Apr 10, 2013)

That is great!

Florida Forks


----------



## Genoa Slingshot (Oct 29, 2015)

I think that's a good idea.
As you know I have to re-do my tube master, so, if you give me the copyright (  ), I can try to do your project in 18mm marine plywood. Do you think this is thick enough?


----------



## Byudzai (Aug 31, 2013)

noemarc said:


> I think that's a good idea.
> As you know I have to re-do my tube master, so, if you give me the copyright (  ), I can try to do your project in 18mm marine plywood. Do you think this is thick enough?


I would discourage you from using this attachment in plywood. I admit that my original versions were made from thin bamboo cutting boards and I never had any breakages, but it wasn't the brightest idea. Plywood has unpredictable grain patterns and is best suited to thick designs with no holes. If you can get some micarta or aluminum it would work great, just need to set up a jig to get the side holes lined up straight.


----------



## Can-Opener (May 11, 2013)

I am just a bit confused?. Bills design is in the template section. Are you just talking about drawing in the band attachments?


----------



## Genoa Slingshot (Oct 29, 2015)

Byudzai said:


> noemarc said:
> 
> 
> > I think that's a good idea.As you know I have to re-do my tube master, so, if you give me the copyright (  ), I can try to do your project in 18mm marine plywood. Do you think this is thick enough?
> ...


Ok, thanks for the advice. I renounce to do my plywood tube master and will wait to have a good HDPE sheet, so I'll try to do either original Bill and Byudzai design...


----------



## Byudzai (Aug 31, 2013)

Can-Opener said:


> I am just a bit confused?. Bills design is in the template section. Are you just talking about drawing in the band attachments?


Hey Can,

Sorry for confusion, this is a .dxf file I drew up in CAD, so it can be cut by a waterjet guy or otherwise used in a computer-assisted cutting operation. I was going to get one of these cut from my 1/2" G10 planks and finish it up in my shop.


----------



## monkeyboab (Aug 13, 2011)

I think that will work very well Byudzai. It will test the ground for the tube/fork attachment (python?) method to get used on many frame designs  :bouncy: Looking forward to seeing it when you get it finished.


----------



## slingshooterPT (Feb 22, 2014)

It looks realy good!! Imo it will work great!


----------



## Chuck Daehler (Mar 17, 2015)

Great melding of designs Alex... you're on top of it again! Dr. Slingshot.

About the plywood...agree...too iffy if that little piece breaks off but 3/4 if impregnated might be OK for moderate tubes. If resin such as Cactus Juice is vacuumed into the wood using a hand vacuum pump and a vacuum chamber, might be all that's needed.

There are a myriad of good plastics and g10 available however for risk reduction materials.


----------



## Can-Opener (May 11, 2013)

Byudzai said:


> Can-Opener said:
> 
> 
> > I am just a bit confused?. Bills design is in the template section. Are you just talking about drawing in the band attachments?
> ...


Thanks for the clarification  I get that G-10 is fun to cut for sure


----------



## grappo73 (Dec 15, 2015)

Good work this SS rulez!!!


----------



## CornDawg (Sep 27, 2015)

I give an all thumbs-up! A FlatCat with a surface to pinch? All day long Alex...

A FlatCat with a surface to pinch and a 1.3 inch longer handle? Priceless...

I've found your attachment method, at both the fork and the pouch, to be the most accurate and consistent setup that I've ever tried, and I was never a tube guy. The fork gap, height, and profile seem spot on to me, and inspire confidence. If I could move that little honey comfortably into the crotch of my hand, there'd be no stopping me. Fame, glory, better fitting shirts-- all possible.


----------



## CornDawg (Sep 27, 2015)

Well heck, I can't quit noodling it now. How 'bout your fork and tube arrangement atop a grip profile like that of Bill's small Hathcock?

The *MasterCat! *Yup, I'm always thinkin'...


----------



## Byudzai (Aug 31, 2013)

Hi CornDawg,

I used to be a devout pinch-grip user because it fosters a more natural position of the hand. It may still be my favorite in a thicker frame, but I have two gripes with it:

1. It can cause pain and nerve problems in the thumb (I've seen several cases of both) with thinner materials.
2. It doesn't put the 3-5th fingers of my hand in an optimal position to provide leverage where you want it to resist pull on the forks. Bringing the thumb out aligns the smaller fingers at the center of the lever arm and gives me a little more sure purchase on the end of the grip.

That's just my $0.02. I won't be producing any of Bill's slingshots with my forks because those are his to sell; I'm just noodling around like you.

Happy Sunday!


----------



## CornDawg (Sep 27, 2015)

I hear ya Byudzai, and I certainly didn't mean to suggest any kind of infringement. Truth is, I really do love your fork setup. I've had to adjust my grip to place my ring finger in the hole and shoot it hammer-grip fashion, and find myself longing for something more substantial to hold onto. I've always had trouble shooting with my thumb and forefinger as a platform because it incorporates too many hand muscles, whereas feeling the waist deep in the webbing twixt my thumb and forefinger allow me to feel the draw in the long muscles of the forearm, while keeping my hand relaxed.

I know the essence of the FlatCat was pocketability, but I feel your fork and band setup is too good to limit to a pocket model... There, I said it. If you ever feel inclined to mount your fork and bands on a conventional straight or teardrop handle, I'd like to be first on the beta-test list.


----------



## Byudzai (Aug 31, 2013)

CornDawg said:


> I hear ya Byudzai, and I certainly didn't mean to suggest any kind of infringement. Truth is, I really do love your fork setup. I've had to adjust my grip to place my ring finger in the hole and shoot it hammer-grip fashion, and find myself longing for something more substantial to hold onto. I've always had trouble shooting with my thumb and forefinger as a platform because it incorporates too many hand muscles, whereas feeling the waist deep in the webbing twixt my thumb and forefinger allow me to feel the draw in the long muscles of the forearm, while keeping my hand relaxed.
> 
> I know the essence of the FlatCat was pocketability, but I feel your fork and band setup is too good to limit to a pocket model... There, I said it. If you ever feel inclined to mount your fork and bands on a conventional straight or teardrop handle, I'd like to be first on the beta-test list.


I may do something like that down the road. A big fat frame that fills the hand is an amazing shooting platform. I have one in the style of Wingshooter and it's a genius feat of ergonomics.

That said, don't give up on thumb-on-frame just yet. Like you, I rejected it completely in the beginning as an ergonomic travesty, but I've since decided it's just the opposite. I like the control of having my thumb in charge instead of left hanging, and the 3-5th fingers are more important than you might suspect.


----------



## CornDawg (Sep 27, 2015)

I'm still at it. I go through phases... It's my hands Byudzai.

I have average length, thick fingers and cartoonishly large palms.

Not the most dexterous setup but I can swim like a son-of-a-gun.


----------



## slingshooterPT (Feb 22, 2014)

Its cool how different people prefer different stuff...If I want to be the best acurate I can I need to be shooting a prataform like a sealsniper that allows me to realy thumb support it if you understand me!


----------



## Byudzai (Aug 31, 2013)

Hi guys. Made a draft of this idea, see top.


----------



## monkeyboab (Aug 13, 2011)

Looks GOOD!


----------

