# Help me shoot BB's!



## MikeyLikesIt

I want to like shooting BB's. I really do. I like everything about shooting smaller ammo. I prefer smaller frames that fit into my pocket. I like using light bands and tubes to chase cans around. I like being able to pack 50-60 1/4" steel comfortably in my back pocket. I enjoy being able to shoot near people in parks with something unobtrusive and non-threatening.

But I'm not having any luck with BB's. I've been using copper .177 ammo I stole from my brother, and it's been one problem after another. I am calling upon you, the wise greybeards and plinkers of the forum, to help me give it one last 'college try' before giving up altogether and settling on larger, more expensive 1/4" steel as my go-to ammo.

I'd like to hear all your tips and preferred methods, but there are three things I seem to be struggling with in particular:

1. What pouch size? I've been cutting pouches out of old soft leather, and it often feels like the BB just gets lost in there. It's hard to tell if the ammo is settled deep in the pocket and centered correctly, and it's hard to tell if my misses are related to my poor ability or using the wrong type of pouch. So what do you prefer? What size, material, or brand pouch should I use?

2. What band strength? I've been using single 1632 tubes for my small ammo, but my accuracy is slightly erratic. Are they too overpowered for BB's? Is there a BB setup I should/could just purchase from a supplier? My pouch and band tying skills are pretty sad, and I'm sure that's affecting my aim as much as my choice of tubes.

3. How do I grip? I learned to grip ammo from Bill Hays. I use my thumb pad and the second knuckle on my forefinger. I pinch the ammo itself, making sure not to pinch in front of it. This seems rather difficult with BB's though, as I can barely feel them sometimes. How do you all do it?

Sorry for the long post. Shooting BB's is my ultimate goal at this point, for both cost effectiveness and ease of carry, and I'm willing to throw down some dollars to get the right bands, pouches etc. Just point me in the right direction!


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## Grandpa Grumpy

I use #64 office bands for .177 BBs. I cut the loops and use one band per side. They have plenty of power for bbs. I use a bb pouch from Simple Shot. I have never gotten any real accuracy. I can hit an aluminum can often enough to keep me interested but that is about it. I suspect my release is the problem. I just can't feel the bb.


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## MikeyLikesIt

Grandpa Grumpy said:


> I use #64 office bands for .177 BBs. I cut the loops and use one band per side. They have plenty of power for bbs. I use a bb pouch from Simple Shot. I have never gotten any real accuracy. I can hit an aluminum can often enough to keep me interested but that is about it. I suspect my release is the problem. I just can't feel the bb.
> 
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> IMG_20190726_121848.jpg


hmm. I have the same issue. I can't really "feel" the BB or how I'm holding it. I suspect my bands are too powerful though, so I'll certainly look into the #64's.


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## Grandpa Pete

I have made a few very small natural frames and banded with #64 rubber bands or when I can find them extra large bands used to hold plastic bags in waste baskets . I use small, light weight pouches made from deer hide. They are thin enough that you can actually feel the BB in the pouch.

GP


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## AKA Forgotten

For 177's I have only used flat bands, but pouches for this one I stick to lightweight 5015 fibre pouches from Wu Jim, but similar pouches are available elsewhere.


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## SLINGDUDE

I really enjoy shooting BBs and have tried a few different setups. I'll try to share some of my experience, hopefully it can help. I have included a few pics of some past setups as well for reference. Also, just bear in mind that most of slingshooting comes down to personal preference so what I like might not work for you.

1. Pouch size: I like a pretty small pouch for bbs. I tried making some tiny leather pouches, but found that I liked the cheap chinese microfiber ones better. The pouch in the picture with the jellybean is one of my favorites right now, it came as a freebie in an order from gzk, but you can buy them on his website. But any small microfiber with a small enough or no center hole is good for me. I'll link a few examples of styles of pouches that I like for bbs.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/5PCS-Microfiber-Leather-Slingshot-Pouches-Muiti-Hole-Outdoor-Hunting-Sling-Shots-Catapults-Accessories-Random-Color-50x15x8mm/32839703244.html?src=google&albslr=225494945&src=google&albch=shopping&acnt=494-037-6276&isdl=y&slnk=&plac=&mtctp=&albbt=Google_7_shopping&aff_platform=google&aff_short_key=UneMJZVf&&albagn=888888&albcp=1582410664&albag=59754279756&trgt=539263010115&crea=en32839703244&netw=u&device=c&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIqsGh4ZrT4wIV5__jBx2IYAzQEAQYASABEgIbJPD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

P5b and P4g from GZK https://gzkchina.onloon.net/detail?itemId=97f4d2749d0d49f5bc5853442c724e79

Warrior Ninja pouch https://www.ebay.com/itm/Warrior-Pouches-Slingshot-BB-pouch-microfiber-laminated-Luxury-Ninja-x-5/273815127646?hash=item3fc0a7465e:g:eNwAAOSwyZhcu4K6

2. Bands. I used to primarily use single tubes for bbs, 1632 and SS extra small, but I've found that, personally, I'm more consistant with thin, narrow flats. The green bands on the jellybean are about 11 mm wide straight cuts of 0.6 mm Ussop band. I'm not sure of the active length, I just kinda eyeball what looks right and then adjust by feel. Shooting fixed anchor I have a 36 inch draw. I use 0.55 mm precise and 0.45 mm sumeike a lot as well. I have a set of 0.45 cut to 13mm (straight) that I really like for bbs as well. I use the 0.55 as an all purpose band and use several different straight cuts and small tapers (maybe 2 or 3 mm difference between frame and pouch end) with similar effectiveness. In general, you don't need much rubber. Draw weight on a dedicated .177 setup should be quite low. I have never used the Theraband Blue bb specific flat bands that SS sells, but others seem to have good experiences with them.

3. Grip. This is where I differ from a lot of shooters, as I shoot with my thumb down and grip the ammo with the tips of my index finger and thumb. I shoot bbs with a very deliberate opening of the digits, not the "relax the grip" method. When I grip a bb to shoot, I'm gripping the bb and the pouch directly in front of the shot. It's difficult to explain, but somehow it allows me to be consistent enough with release. Obviously, with a thicker pouch (like the gzk P5b on the jellybean), the feel will be different than a thin pouch. Personally I've grown to prefer the thicker microfiber material. It might be counterintuitive, but I feel like i have better "feel" and controlled release with a thicker pouch material.

https://slingshotforum.com/topic/117864-thumb-down-pouch-hold/?p=1324412

Hope this helps. Don't give up and keep experimenting and I'm sure you will find a setup that works for you and your individual style.


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## KawKan

Hang tough, Mikey!

BBs are tough to master, but you know the rewards are great.

1. Pouches. The small microfiber pouches work well for me when knew. I have used one so much I was loosing ammo through the centering hole during the shot. I make a lot of my own pouches and I like leather cut 3/8" by 2" for .177 steel. I can shoot thin pouches, but I favor something with enough substance to feel a little stiff.

2. Bands. I like office rubber, narrow cuts of latex flatbands, and 1632 tube. While you're climbing that learning curve, you may want to add an inch to your 1632 tube sets.

3. Grip. That really is where the magic happens. My first plateau of success with BBs came with a PFS style hold and release. That is, a 90 degree turn of the pouch, and a slight bend, away from the opening of the forks. I still use the 90 degree turn, but I shoot without a bend, unless I'm shooting PFS. My current grip is the same you use. I start out pinching hard, so the pouch closes in front of the BB while I draw, and when I am near full draw, I relax the grip just enough to feel the pouch shift forward (not slip, the skin of my finger moves with the pouch) and opens in front of the ammo. Then I gently relax the grip to release. I guess I have to pinch hard to feel the BB, but can't release cleanly from the hard pinch. One additional point of focus - true with any light bands - work on feeling absolute neutral with the hold. That is, no up, down, left or right pressure on the pouch when you release.

Keep shooting, Mikey! Perseverance will pay!


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## SLINGDUDE

KawKan said:


> ...I start out pinching hard, so the pouch closes in front of the BB while I draw, and when I am near full draw, I relax the grip just enough to feel the pouch shift forward (not slip, the skin of my finger moves with the pouch) and opens in front of the ammo. Then I gently relax the grip to release.


This is a very good explanation of what I was trying to describe and exactly how i grip and draw a bb in the pouch, but I use a more active final release and no twist.

Most of what I know about shooting bbs and light setups came from KawKan's and others past posts on the subject.


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## Long John

I'm just reading this wondering what it's gonna be like to go bigger.. i feel like the release mechanics change noticeably just from .177 to 1/4" (all I've shot). Just my $0.02 

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## Long John

I'm just reading this wondering what it's gonna be like to go bigger.. i feel like the release mechanics change noticeably just from .177 to 1/4" (all I've shot). Just my $0.02 

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## KawKan

It seems to me that moving up in ammo size is less challenging than moving down.

The smaller ammo seems less forgiving of errors, and the .177 is the least forgiving of all.


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## Grandpa Grumpy

KawKan said:


> It seems to me that moving up in ammo size is less challenging than moving down.
> The smaller ammo seems less forgiving of errors, and the .177 is the least forgiving of all.


I agree.


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## Long John

KawKan said:


> It seems to me that moving up in ammo size is less challenging than moving down.
> The smaller ammo seems less forgiving of errors, and the .177 is the least forgiving of all.


I'm not trying to make comparisons other than the difference between ammo sizes regardless of going up or down.. The mechanics changeed for me and I thought it was relevant... I'm so new I thought not to give specific recommendations, and I have nothing but good experience with BBs (.177)

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## Long John

Con somebody explain why everything I post is all of a sudden questionable???

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## Long John

As if I'm trying to go around offending people...

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## MakoPat

Thanks, Mikey for asking.

Thanks wise greybeards for answering.

I just bought some .177 bbs after watching Nathan Masters interview Rayshot.

We can learn these tiny terrors of accuracy & consistency together.


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## Northerner

As mentioned above, the small microfiber pouches work great for BBs, until they get stretched out too much. I like BB pouches about 44-50mm in length and about 12mm width.

For BB bands there are lots of options. The 1632 singles or pseudo-tapers are great. You can rev those tiny balls to 250-280fps and reach out to 30 yards or more. A skinny 5/16" cut of TBG or maybe Precise Yellow .55mm would be fine too. The .45mm Pink Sumeike should be good but I don't think I tried them yet with BBs. I had some Sanctband Plum bands shooting BBs at almost 300fps but they didn't last too long. The 117B office bands work fine and you don't have to cut them. Unfortunately they don't last too long if you stretch them to 31-32".

I pinch the pouch right on top of the BB and maybe a bit in front. The small BB requires a firm hold and my fingers get a bit sore/tender after a few lengthy shooting sessions.


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## AKA Forgotten

Long John said:


> Con somebody explain why everything I post is all of a sudden questionable???
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Fear not, nothing you post is causing offence or considered wrong. You're going through a learning curve all of us are on lol

One of the Joy's of slingshots is we all experience different things with the same setup, be it ammo, bands, ammo style etc.


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## mattwalt

Shooting BB's is awesome. You can get a whole hobby to fit in your jeans watch pocket (even with a few hundred shot) - and also means you can shoot any time you are able (as you'd have it to hand). I think I shoot more BB's than any other ammo combined...

Firstly - the cheap 'red' Chinese pouches work amazing - though the last batch I got were larger and more pliable than the ones I've had before and the BB's can actually fall through the centring hole... But thats fine as BB setups work just as well slinging 6mm... The size I use is about 11 x 45mm

Secondly - elastic (office) bands work fine but I find them to be short lived - use single (or very short pseudo) 1632 tubes - they last ages and are very consistent. I make them for around a 450-480%

You want the pouch/tube setup to be light and minimal as possible - once you get the setup figured out there's no looking back. BB's are laser fast and surprisingly accurate when its dialled in - but they can be overwhelmed very easily having them flying all over if your bands are too powerful for them.

I grip between thumb and the first joint of my index finger...

Also don't be sacred to use larger frames for BB's - the SS Torque is a stunning BB shooter. Some small frames feel great but they don't always shoot as accurately as others...


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## mattwalt

You could also try starting with heavyweight airsoft 6mm plastic - these are about the same weight as BB's but obviously larger.


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## AKA Forgotten

Thanks Matt, been trying to remember where mine came from.


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## Pebble Shooter

Any slingshot can be used to shoot .177 BB's with the right bands and pouch set up.

As many office rubber band brands tend to use second-rate rubber (lower elasticity), I opted for GZK flat band rubber (0.8 mm thickness) cut to 20 cm length, and tapered from 8 mm to 5 mm.

The .177 steel BB's weigh in at about 0.3 grams, which implies that even fairly thin flat band material such as Theraband blue would be sufficient: some experimenting is required in terms of widths and taper, but generally speaking, something along the sizes of larger office rubber bands is what to look for.

An adapted pouch size, as well as a very small center hole and indented sides at the pouch center are helpful to facilitate holding and centering this very small ammo. My leather pouch is cut to 15 x 30 mm, has a small center hole, and the indented sides (photos attached herewith). This works quite well for me.

The pouch could be even smaller, say 10 x 20 mm, but holding it becomes rather tedious depending on finger widths concerned. Once again, one needs to experiment.

Given the limitations in terms of rubber retraction speeds, I find that target shooting at around 6 - 7 yards yields the best results using .177 steel BB's.


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## mattwalt

My first home-made BB pouch was 8 x 18mm - it did work well.

Also did some shooting - actually I find I'm pinching between the thumb and foreigner tips...


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## Grandpa Grumpy

Long John said:


> Con somebody explain why everything I post is all of a sudden questionable???
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Are you taking offense where none was given?


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## Rayshot

At one point all I could shoot for three months was .177. A few of things I found.

1) Tubes can more fussy and prone to issues with accurate shooting.

2) I have used my 12 mm x 63mm magnetic pouch with excellent results as well as one cut to 55 mm long.

3) I have use much smaller non magnetic pouches with success.

4) Consistent ammo placement is important along

5) A good feel of the ammo in the pouch and the hold being consistent ( haven't tried a pouch that I can't feel the ammo and it position in the pouch)

6) This to me is very important for accurate bb shooting; a sensitive touch as to consistent hold *and release. *It appears that the lighter the band set the more sensitive I have to be with all things related to the pouch and release.

Also; I shoot the 66 mm long mag pouch through fork gaps 1 5/8 wide and 1 7/16 wide. No problems.

The different sizes of fork gaps of shooters I use. The small one was just for fun.


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## SLING-N-SHOT

KawKan said:


> It seems to me that moving up in ammo size is less challenging than moving down.
> The smaller ammo seems less forgiving of errors, and the .177 is the least forgiving of all.


Agreed.....I started out with 177 bb's, and have a lot of trouble with consistency, using TBBlue flats from SS, but have done way better with 1/4, 8 & 10 mm steel

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## SLING-N-SHOT

Long John said:


> As if I'm trying to go around offending people...
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Not offended at all, I like seeing everyone posting as log ad it's helpful and informative 

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## MikeyLikesIt

MakoPat said:


> Thanks, Mikey for asking.
> 
> Thanks wise greybeards for answering.
> 
> I just bought some .177 bbs after watching Nathan Masters interview Rayshot.
> 
> We can learn these tiny terrors of accuracy & consistency together.


Where can I find that interview?


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## MikeyLikesIt

Thanks for all the responses! While I do appreciate powerful setups and large ammo (I've got the Bad Company 1.4 plans on my workbench right now ) my favorite thing about slingshots is the ability to slip a frame and some ammo into my jean pocket and shoot as the opportunity arises. Most of my shooting takes place in public spaces within the city, so the smaller frame and ammo are both inconspicuous and less intimidating to anyone who may see me shooting. (I once frightened a woman when she came upon me shooting a wrist rocket and marbles. The sound of the marble's impact was reverberating through the area and sounded intimidating. I can't help bet think she'd have been less startled if I was shooting .177 ammo and using a small frame).

I'll be sure to implement the recommendations you've given me and stick with it. It seems that while .177 demands a cleaner release and technique, the setup used can make all the difference in accuracy, hand slaps, etc. I don't know how well the technique will improve, but I can certainly tailor my rig to give me the best chance at success. As long as I can hit some cans at 10 paces I'm a happy guy


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## SLING-N-SHOT

MikeyLikesIt said:


> I use #64 office bands for .177 BBs. I cut the loops and use one band per side. They have plenty of power for bbs. I use a bb pouch from Simple Shot. I have never gotten any real accuracy. I can hit an aluminum can often enough to keep me interested but that is about it. I suspect my release is the problem. I just can't feel the bb.
> 
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> IMG_20190726_121848.jpg


hmm. I have the same issue. I can't really "feel" the BB or how I'm holding it. I suspect my bands are too powerful though, so I'll certainly look into the #64's.[/quote

If you have a Hobby Lobby near you, they carry a really thin, but very strong Goat leather that makes a decent pouch.....probably be great for BB's
https://www.hobbylobby.com/Crafts-Hobbies/Leather-Crafting/Leather-Pieces/Goatskin-Leather/p/80780194

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## Long John

Grandpa Grumpy said:


> Long John said:
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> Con somebody explain why everything I post is all of a sudden questionable???
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
> 
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> 
> Are you taking offense where none was given?
Click to expand...

Are you actually keeping track of what I'm referring?

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## Long John

Sorry to shit post on your thread Mikeylikesit...

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## SLING-N-SHOT

Also found these on the Hobby Lobby site.....might be too small though ? 
https://www.hobbylobby.com/Crafts-Hobbies/Leather-Crafting/Leather-Pieces/Mini-Leather-Links/p/155773

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## Grandpa Grumpy

SLINGINSHOT said:


> Also found these on the Hobby Lobby site.....might be too small though ? https://www.hobbylobby.com/Crafts-Hobbies/Leather-Crafting/Leather-Pieces/Mini-Leather-Links/p/155773
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I have seen those at Hobby Lobby. They are very thick leather. I don't think you could fold them tight enough to hold a BB.


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## SLING-N-SHOT

Grandpa Grumpy said:


> SLINGINSHOT said:
> 
> 
> 
> Also found these on the Hobby Lobby site.....might be too small though ? https://www.hobbylobby.com/Crafts-Hobbies/Leather-Crafting/Leather-Pieces/Mini-Leather-Links/p/155773
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
> 
> 
> 
> I have seen those at Hobby Lobby. They are very thick leather. I don't think you could fold them tight enough to hold a BB.
Click to expand...

Good to know GP, tks

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## MIsling

I prefer 1/2 inch Theraband black straight cuts for my bb shooting. They are fast enough to be accurate but not so fast as to overpower them. I have tried 1632 tubes with some success but they seemed slightly overpowered. I use small microfiber pouches.

I grip and release normally, though like Kawkan said having a neutral hold is very important, it is easy to throw the shot off.

Any frame will work with bbs, but my favorite is a small 80% scale chalice I cut from a natural fork.

Just keep shooting them, you'll figure them out eventually!


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## Hulla Baloo

I can't shoot BBs or quarters worth beans. I've tried countless times. I needs to feel the pea. When I'm shooting well I can "feel" the target in the pouch, as odd as that may sound. It's as if I'm pulling the target back into the pouch when I draw. 5/16 is the smallest I can go and still have that connection. Release is 80% of this game. Ya gotta feel it to heal it...


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## tm3

No expert here by any means, but BBs are all that I shoot.

You might want to try eliminating some variables by using a set of theraband blue flat bands from Simple Shot with the BB pouch pre-installed.

I hold the slingshot horizontally, and when I changed to a 45 degree CCW rotation while drawing back to anchor from a straight back draw my accuracy went up a lot.


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## MakoPat

Hey Mikey!

Here is a link to the interview of Ray...I think.


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## Northerner

*SimpleShot Dead Ringer*

I had some fun plinking pop cans this afternoon with BBs and the SimpleShot Dead Ringer. I had it banded up with 1632 amber tubes. Tube cut was pseudo-taper 7 7/8" overall length with 3" of doubled up section. Speed was clocked at 225fps with my 32" draw length. Pop cans at 18-20 yards were not a problem. This slingshot is so small that you could have it in your closed hand and nobody would know.


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## skropi

Long John said:


> Grandpa Grumpy said:
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> Long John said:
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> Con somebody explain why everything I post is all of a sudden questionable???
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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> 
> Are you taking offense where none was given?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Are you actually keeping track of what I'm referring?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

He is keeping track, yes, and actually no one here has any clue why you feel that way. No one questioned or insulted you, and if it happened, try and quote the post


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## Samurai Samoht

skropi said:


> Long John said:
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> Grandpa Grumpy said:
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> Long John said:
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> Con somebody explain why everything I post is all of a sudden questionable???
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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> 
> Are you taking offense where none was given?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Are you actually keeping track of what I'm referring?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> He is keeping track, yes, and actually no one here has any clue why you feel that way. No one questioned or insulted you, and if it happened, try and quote the post
Click to expand...

I was trying to figure out what caused Long John to feel like somebody was offended with him. I see nothing in this thread so maybe I'm unaware of another conversation elsewhere. Long John, I think you are good man, keep posting! :thumbsup:


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## Northerner

Here are a couple of my favorite small pocketable frames for BB shooting. Both are wearing 1632 pseudo-tapered tubes and microfiber pouches.

*SimpleShot Jelly Bean and SimpleShot Dead Ringer*


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## MakoPat

A deadringer is a fine pochetable bb shooter.

And a Jellybean. Nice.

Ps- how is the bb queat coming along?


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## MikeyLikesIt

MakoPat said:


> A deadringer is a fine pochetable bb shooter.
> 
> And a Jellybean. Nice.
> 
> Ps- how is the bb queat coming along?


It's going! I just received some pouches from a generous benefactor, and will be cutting some fresh bands to make a dedicated BB shooter setup. I'm going to try them on a homemade frame and we'll see if we can't get some decent groupings!


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## MakoPat

Great news. Here is my setup and cans are still pretty safe at 20'-25'. Hahaha...

LBS with phat bamboo and #64 office band chains that are fun, but wonky.


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## MikeyLikesIt

Nice setup! I just got some #64 bands sent to me, and I'm planning on going that route for shooting. I'll post a pic when I get it all set up. I've noticed my form mistakes are a lot more glaring shooting these light bands and ammo. Any little movement of the hand or incorrect release really screws up your shot. I'm hoping it will translate to better accuracy with my other frames too.


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## Alfred E.M.

Northerner said:


> Here are a couple of my favorite small pocketable frames for BB shooting. Both are wearing 1632 pseudo-tapered tubes and microfiber pouches.
> 
> *SimpleShot Jelly Bean and SimpleShot Dead Ringer*


*Solid shooting as always, inspires me to shoot my J. Bean today. * :thumbsup:


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## Long John

SamuraiSamoht said:


> skropi said:
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> Long John said:
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> Grandpa Grumpy said:
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> Long John said:
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> Con somebody explain why everything I post is all of a sudden questionable???
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> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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> Are you taking offense where none was given?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Are you actually keeping track of what I'm referring?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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> Click to expand...
> 
> He is keeping track, yes, and actually no one here has any clue why you feel that way. No one questioned or insulted you, and if it happened, try and quote the post
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I was trying to figure out what caused Long John to feel like somebody was offended with him. I see nothing in this thread so maybe I'm unaware of another conversation elsewhere. Long John, I think you are good man, keep posting! :thumbsup:
Click to expand...

I thought I was getting some attitude from a few, turns out it was maybe just the one (not kawkan), no more names.. Miscommunication and some over reaction on my part. ...great forum

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## Long John

SLING-N-SHOT said:


> Long John said:
> 
> 
> 
> As if I'm trying to go around offending people...
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
> 
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> 
> Not offended at all, I like seeing everyone posting as log ad it's helpful and informative
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

This seems to be a misquote.. my bad

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## MakoPat

I am going to post some video. It is painful to watch due to sound issues. I am shooting 30' with my above LBS and, of course, .177 bbs.

It was fun. I broke my set and now have a less wonky one. Also a few pics of the damage...suprising damage. I was aiming at the bar code.

Video 1 is just me setting up.





Video 2 is the shooting. 1st shooting with no warm up off camera. Skip to 2 minutes for the fun.


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## AKA Forgotten

MakoPat said:


> I am going to post some video. It is painful to watch due to sound issues. I am shooting 30' with my above LBS and, of course, .177 bbs.
> 
> It was fun. I broke my set and now have a less wonky one. Also a few pics of the damage...suprising damage. I was aiming at the bar code.
> 
> Video 1 is just me setting up.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Video 2 is the shooting. 1st shooting with no warm up off camera. Skip to 2 minutes for the fun.


Best way to open a can lol I do love the look of that LBS


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## Grandpa Grumpy

Nice shooting video. If I could make a suggestion. It looks like you are using two #64 bands on each side. I think that is way too much power for .177 bbs. You are probably getting a lot of knuckle balls with that much power. Try one cut loop of #64 per side. This is plenty of power for .117 bbs.


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## SJAaz

I agree with Grampa. I tried chains, doubles, everything I saw on this forum. Single bands worked best for me. BB zips out there so fast, I can't see it travel. Also, don't have any proof of this, but I think that the pouch opens better with singles. ???


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## MikeyLikesIt

Grandpa Grumpy said:


> Nice shooting video. If I could make a suggestion. It looks like you are using two #64 bands on each side. I think that is way too much power for .177 bbs. You are probably getting a lot of knuckle balls with that much power. Try one cut loop of #64 per side. This is plenty of power for .117 bbs.


I'm gonna need to find some bigger #64 bands. Cut, I can barely pull them full draw (30" or so) without them maxing out or breaking. Till them I'll be sticking with the 1632 I guess.


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## KawKan

MIkey, you may not have #64 bands there. Looking at the photo, I'm guess they are #32s. They are 1/8-inch wide vs. 1/4-inch for the #64s. Cut, they would be 6 inches instead of 7 inches long.

Keep looking!



MikeyLikesIt said:


> Grandpa Grumpy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Nice shooting video. If I could make a suggestion. It looks like you are using two #64 bands on each side. I think that is way too much power for .177 bbs. You are probably getting a lot of knuckle balls with that much power. Try one cut loop of #64 per side. This is plenty of power for .117 bbs.
> 
> 
> 
> I'm gonna need to find some bigger #64 bands. Cut, I can barely pull them full draw (30" or so) without them maxing out or breaking. Till them I'll be sticking with the 1632 I guess.
Click to expand...


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## SJAaz

MikeyLikesIt said:


> Grandpa Grumpy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Nice shooting video. If I could make a suggestion. It looks like you are using two #64 bands on each side. I think that is way too much power for .177 bbs. You are probably getting a lot of knuckle balls with that much power. Try one cut loop of #64 per side. This is plenty of power for .117 bbs.
> 
> 
> 
> I'm gonna need to find some bigger #64 bands. Cut, I can barely pull them full draw (30" or so) without them maxing out or breaking. Till them I'll be sticking with the 1632 I guess.
Click to expand...

Gypsy tabs Mike!


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## SJAaz

MikeyLikesIt said:


> Grandpa Grumpy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Nice shooting video. If I could make a suggestion. It looks like you are using two #64 bands on each side. I think that is way too much power for .177 bbs. You are probably getting a lot of knuckle balls with that much power. Try one cut loop of #64 per side. This is plenty of power for .117 bbs.
> 
> 
> 
> I'm gonna need to find some bigger #64 bands. Cut, I can barely pull them full draw (30" or so) without them maxing out or breaking. Till them I'll be sticking with the 1632 I guess.
Click to expand...

Hey Mike!


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## SJAaz

View attachment 268120




MikeyLikesIt said:


> Grandpa Grumpy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Nice shooting video. If I could make a suggestion. It looks like you are using two #64 bands on each side. I think that is way too much power for .177 bbs. You are probably getting a lot of knuckle balls with that much power. Try one cut loop of #64 per side. This is plenty of power for .117 bbs.
> 
> 
> 
> I'm gonna need to find some bigger #64 bands. Cut, I can barely pull them full draw (30" or so) without them maxing out or breaking. Till them I'll be sticking with the 1632 I guess.
Click to expand...

Mike this will extend your draw.


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## MakoPat

Grandpa Grumpy said:


> Nice shooting video. If I could make a suggestion. It looks like you are using two #64 bands on each side. I think that is way too much power for .177 bbs. You are probably getting a lot of knuckle balls with that much power. Try one cut loop of #64 per side. This is plenty of power for .117 bbs.


I do appreciate any and all tips. I took you advice and made some 2-1 pauedo-taper...and I was falling a tad short/hitting low...

My draw length may be the issue. I have perma-bent wlbows on short arms...So on a good day 26" is my longest draw. I have a consistent draw of 24".

So I went back to 2x2. And I am getting okay, which I have not been good in a while.

But just to make sure and eliminate bias/error...I have made a few more 2-1 band sets and this Saturday I aim to do some real shooting.

Again thanks. Much appreciated. I am gonna keep leaving my personal finding here for posterity all the same.


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## MikeyLikesIt

SJAaz said:


> 0806190851.jpg
> 
> 
> 
> MikeyLikesIt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Grandpa Grumpy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Nice shooting video. If I could make a suggestion. It looks like you are using two #64 bands on each side. I think that is way too much power for .177 bbs. You are probably getting a lot of knuckle balls with that much power. Try one cut loop of #64 per side. This is plenty of power for .117 bbs.
> 
> 
> 
> I'm gonna need to find some bigger #64 bands. Cut, I can barely pull them full draw (30" or so) without them maxing out or breaking. Till them I'll be sticking with the 1632 I guess.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hey Mike!
Click to expand...

I like it! My tabs are usually pretty small, just a means of attaching bands to forks. I never thought about using them to extend draw like that. I'll give it a shot (and I'm gonna have to look up those Irish cigars too )


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## MikeyLikesIt

MakoPat said:


> Grandpa Grumpy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Nice shooting video. If I could make a suggestion. It looks like you are using two #64 bands on each side. I think that is way too much power for .177 bbs. You are probably getting a lot of knuckle balls with that much power. Try one cut loop of #64 per side. This is plenty of power for .117 bbs.
> 
> 
> 
> I do appreciate any and all tips. I took you advice and made some 2-1 pauedo-taper...and I was falling a tad short/hitting low...
> 
> My draw length may be the issue. I have perma-bent wlbows on short arms...So on a good day 26" is my longest draw. I have a consistent draw of 24".
> 
> So I went back to 2x2. And I am getting okay, which I have not been good in a while.
> 
> But just to make sure and eliminate bias/error...I have made a few more 2-1 band sets and this Saturday I aim to do some real shooting.
> 
> Again thanks. Much appreciated. I am gonna keep leaving my personal finding here for posterity all the same.
Click to expand...

Keep us posted Pat! I watched that video, and was intrigued at the concept of .177 shooting refining technique which can translate to better shooting for hunting/competition.


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## MakoPat

@Mikeylikesit...Me, too.

Now that I am sitting down and resting... I think I will try to exclusively use Grandpa Grumpy's advised band sets... here's why.

While had some good hits and many near misses, I also had some wild flyers that I attributed to poor releases. But maybe they were poor releases coupled with unbalanced ammo-to-band ratios. Too much power...

One more variable eliminated is going to increase my release enhancement training...well, that is my hope anyway.

So thanks again, ere'body.

But when I finally get my release down...I may do a double band chain for some 1/4"(6mm) ammo...because those are fun to shoot, but also easier to see for pickup.

But as far as shooting while in the woods/public lands for fun .177 bbs and office bands are much more public friendly.


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## skropi

I dont know guys, I found 0.177 bb's too fiddly for my liking, but I totally respect anyone who can actually shoot those little devils.


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## SLINGDUDE

Nice shooting MP!


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## mk4ia

Preferred setups for shooting .177 copperheads and .25g 6mm airsoft.

- TBB 15mm straights

Or

- Sumeike .45 and .50, 12.5mm straight cut

- 1.8mm thick microfiber pouch, 48mm x 16mm with 1mm centering hole for reference.

Indoor setup maxed out at 31' shooting distance. 
1. Release combined with identical anchor point for each shot is very important.
2. I have also been shooting the same frame design (with minor style differences) for over 1 year. Cannot recommend this enough, stick with the same frame.


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## reset

What better topic and thread to post my 1000th post on. Shooting .177 bb"s. If i had only one choice i would shoot .177 bb's only, and i do shoot them almost exclusively. Although i have been having a little fun with homemade ammo outa clay lately. But thats another topic for another time.

For bands i use TBG cut 3/8" x 7 1/4". For the pouch i buy cheap cloth work gloves with the thin leather sewn across where your knuckles go. Usually can find black in that leather. This leather is much stronger than it looks but is very thin. I cut pouches 3/8" x 1 3/4". My draw is 31". You can get at least 4 or 5 pouches outa one pair of gloves.

Some tips that work for me that OP might find helpful. I wet the leather pouch good and then i set it on the edge of a table and put the bb where it will sit in pouch when shooting. I then clamp the bb and the pouch down and leave it till its dry. Now you got a divot for the bb to sit in with no hole needed. I read somewhere on here way back how ( i think it was Rayshot ) had done some that way for bigger ammo. Forgive me if i have the wrong guy, im a little short on memory in my old age. Also i use silver bb's only as you can keep track of the trajectory better. Its more visible in daylight than the copper.


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## AKA Forgotten

reset said:


> What better topic and thread to post my 1000th post on. Shooting .177 bb"s. If i had only one choice i would shoot .177 bb's only, and i do shoot them almost exclusively. Although i have been having a little fun with homemade ammo outa clay lately. But thats another topic for another time.
> For bands i use TBG cut 3/8" x 7 1/4". For the pouch i buy cheap cloth work gloves with the thin leather sewn across where your knuckles go. Usually can find black in that leather. This leather is much stronger than it looks but is very thin. I cut pouches 3/8" x 1 3/4". My draw is 31". You can get at least 4 or 5 pouches outa one pair of gloves.
> 
> Some tips that work for me that OP might find helpful. I wet the leather pouch good and then i set it on the edge of a table and put the bb where it will sit in pouch when shooting. I then clamp the bb and the pouch down and leave it till its dry. Now you got a divot for the bb to sit in with no hole needed. I read somewhere on here way back how ( i think it was Rayshot ) had done some that way for bigger ammo. Forgive me if i have the wrong guy, im a little short on memory in my old age. Also i use silver bb's only as you can keep track of the trajectory better. Its more visible in daylight than the copper.


Congratulations on your 1000th post and information also ????????


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## raiderkilo

For 6 mm BB or Steel I use this Ooak Forge Horny Monster, Harlan make bands too

https://www.ooakforge.com/listing/736471899/scorched-titanium-horny-monster


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## MakoPat

AKA Forgotten said:


> reset said:
> 
> 
> 
> What better topic and thread to post my 1000th post on. Shooting .177 bb"s. If i had only one choice i would shoot .177 bb's only, and i do shoot them almost exclusively. Although i have been having a little fun with homemade ammo outa clay lately. But thats another topic for another time.
> For bands i use TBG cut 3/8" x 7 1/4". For the pouch i buy cheap cloth work gloves with the thin leather sewn across where your knuckles go. Usually can find black in that leather. This leather is much stronger than it looks but is very thin. I cut pouches 3/8" x 1 3/4". My draw is 31". You can get at least 4 or 5 pouches outa one pair of gloves.
> Some tips that work for me that OP might find helpful. I wet the leather pouch good and then i set it on the edge of a table and put the bb where it will sit in pouch when shooting. I then clamp the bb and the pouch down and leave it till its dry. Now you got a divot for the bb to sit in with no hole needed. I read somewhere on here way back how ( i think it was Rayshot ) had done some that way for bigger ammo. Forgive me if i have the wrong guy, im a little short on memory in my old age. Also i use silver bb's only as you can keep track of the trajectory better. Its more visible in daylight than the copper.
> 
> 
> 
> Congratulations on your 1000th post and information also
Click to expand...

Wow! Great 1,000th post. I have been slacking on my posts about this topic...But I have come to love these little .177 ammos. So fun! ...once you get the gist of them.

Right now I shoot .177 and 1/4" (6mm) exclusively...and I am doing okay, but alao consistently hitting at 33' (10m). Not many flyers, but plenty of misses.

How is it with you, Mikeylikesit?


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## Tree Man

I like a roo pouch for bbs. The thinner leather makes it easy to feel the bb in the pouch


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## Thomas_Z

reset said:


> What better topic and thread to post my 1000th post on. Shooting .177 bb"s. If i had only one choice i would shoot .177 bb's only, and i do shoot them almost exclusively. Although i have been having a little fun with homemade ammo outa clay lately. But thats another topic for another time.
> 
> For bands i use TBG cut 3/8" x 7 1/4". For the pouch i buy cheap cloth work gloves with the thin leather sewn across where your knuckles go. Usually can find black in that leather. This leather is much stronger than it looks but is very thin. I cut pouches 3/8" x 1 3/4". My draw is 31". You can get at least 4 or 5 pouches outa one pair of gloves.
> 
> Some tips that work for me that OP might find helpful. I wet the leather pouch good and then i set it on the edge of a table and put the bb where it will sit in pouch when shooting. I then clamp the bb and the pouch down and leave it till its dry. Now you got a divot for the bb to sit in with no hole needed. I read somewhere on here way back how ( i think it was Rayshot ) had done some that way for bigger ammo. Forgive me if i have the wrong guy, im a little short on memory in my old age. Also i use silver bb's only as you can keep track of the trajectory better. Its more visible in daylight than the copper.


Yes! I read this approach somewhere, too. Really worked for me, so nice 1000th post, and nice piece od advice!


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## Old Iowan

I'm also a NEWBIE but I to wanted to shoot BB's and I came up with this one - It's RED tube about 3.5mm or .130" in diameter - The forks are 1/8" metal - I made the leather pouch and use waxed thread for most all my tying - RED 1/4" hose for the handle - All I do know is that it shoots much better than I'm capable of shooting and does not tire the arm!! Hope this helps!


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## MikeyLikesIt

Old Iowan said:


> I'm also a NEWBIE but I to wanted to shoot BB's and I came up with this one - It's RED tube about 3.5mm or .130" in diameter - The forks are 1/8" metal - I made the leather pouch and use waxed thread for most all my tying - RED 1/4" hose for the handle - All I do know is that it shoots much better than I'm capable of shooting and does not tire the arm!! Hope this helps!


That's a great looking little frame! Did you fabricate it yourself? I like the miniature take on a classic wire frame.


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## MikeyLikesIt

I've been off the forum for a few weeks due to busy life, but thought I'd update my progress on this thread. I've played around with a few different setups, but this seems to be the one! Gherkin Gapper frame made from MDF/Bamboo, with tabs and 7" 1632 tubes. I've got a 28" draw length, so that's a x4 stretch factor on the tubes. It's enough to zip the BB's, but doesn't seem to overpower them. Using a microfiber pouch and an ammo pouch from Simpleshot. The whole thing fits in my back pocket or backpack, and I'm killing cans at 10 paces. Thanks for all the tips and info. This forum is a wealth of information 

*Having trouble attaching photo. I'll try again later.


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## MikeyLikesIt

And here it is...


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## Old Iowan

MikeyLikesIt said:


> Old Iowan said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'm also a NEWBIE but I to wanted to shoot BB's and I came up with this one - It's RED tube about 3.5mm or .130" in diameter - The forks are 1/8" metal - I made the leather pouch and use waxed thread for most all my tying - RED 1/4" hose for the handle - All I do know is that it shoots much better than I'm capable of shooting and does not tire the arm!! Hope this helps!
> 
> 
> 
> That's a great looking little frame! Did you fabricate it yourself? I like the miniature take on a classic wire frame.
Click to expand...

Yes...made by myself - I/8" rod can be bought from knife maker's supply places or welding rod or lots of other sources - I've got more of them in the works with different handles and I actually hope to finish some day when mind and body allow!!


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## MakoPat

Wow! Mikeylikesit & Old Lowan,

those are great bb set ups.

I like the 1632 red tubes...but today out of the 4 frames I tried...
My dedicated bb shooter had the most hits.

Also it is the easiest to carry.

Sweet16 flat bands (I think .50mm) at 1/4" (6mm) straight cuts at 5" (12.7 cm) of active bands... my elongation is just at 4.5x.

All shots at 3"(76mm) spinner at 33'(10m) distance.


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## Old Iowan

MakoPat that's chunky Lil' guy/girl - Looks like *Brown Cinnamon* with a little sugar in it....MUST be a really sweet shooter


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## skarrd

here is a system i use for BBs i usually only shoot them during winter in the garage,short distance [18 ft] they last a bit longer than the 64s;oh yeah ,cheek anchor mostly


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## MikeyLikesIt

skarrd said:


> here is a system i use for BBs i usually only shoot them during winter in the garage,short distance [18 ft] they last a bit longer than the 64s;oh yeah ,cheek anchor mostly


Nice little frame there Skarrd! I love how small and easy to pack around these are, and enough low energy to shoot safely indoors.


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## raventree78

skarrd said:


> here is a system i use for BBs i usually only shoot them during winter in the garage,short distance [18 ft] they last a bit longer than the 64s;oh yeah ,cheek anchor mostly


That is a nice setup, I need one like that


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