# Testing of Tubes Today ...I'm NOT Happy ;- (



## wll (Oct 4, 2014)

Well I ventured out of the house today hoping to get somewhere in the neighborhood of 250 - 275 fps with 115gr ammo ...well that did not happen !

It was 55deg F when I tested, shooting my egg shaped 113gr weights over the chrony ....... for all the good it did me I should have shot the chrony !!!!

1) OK I test the looped 2050 first, 198fps for three shots. IMHO that is not to good at all but my draw is 38" and for some reason these would only pull to about 32 ish ... I don't know if 6 inches or so can make a difference of 20-40 fps, I will need to make new tube sets to test I have not given up hope on this at the correct draw length.

Then comes the pseudo 2050, shot with my Zinc China Boy shot at a full 38" draw and this was at the same speed as looped 2050 short draw or a little better average for 3 shots was 201. The draw weight was quite a bit less ... not to bad !

Next was the large Kent tubes (1/8id x 1/16w x 1/4od, in a pseudo configuration, shooting 113gr leads, average of three shots ....175, IMHO his is not good, but it is tough stuff and I may need to have a bigger loop for more power and make the single side work harder. I have some 1/4od Kent with .031 wall thickness coming, who knows how that does, may shoot that in a looped configuration ?

Next was Kent 1/16id x 1/16w x 3/16od pseudos in my new Simple-Shot Torque sling shot ... this crappy tubing size would chuck marbles out at 156fps and my 113gr leads at 138fps, In my youth I could [email protected]@ faster than that !. IMHO the only thing this tubing may be good for is starting a fire ! I have tested this and for me this is not working for anything except to chuck marbles or gumballs out of your back porch when your drunk ! The tubing was such a disappointment I did not get to shoot my new Torque SS much ;-( I should have left the original tubing on except it was way to short for me.

So far, the 1745 and the 2050 are the clear favorites, the 2050 pseudo was surprising, i may need larger/smaller loops, I don't know to get more speed ? I have 3060 and like I mentioned the thin wall 1/4od Kent coming. The 3060 may make a good pseudo, I will need to check. 1745 IMHO is a real sleeper for mid weight leads ;- ) I should try some 1842 !

I took the Kent small tubing and lit it on fire on my living room rug I was so mad (I learned this technique from the protesters in Ferguson, when your unhappy burn your house down !)

wll


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## M.J (Nov 1, 2010)

Yeah, heavy draw weight still doesn't equal big speed.
Use lighter tubes and cut them shorter. Less draw weight and more speed, it's a win-win.


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## wll (Oct 4, 2014)

M.J said:


> Yeah, heavy draw weight still doesn't equal big speed.
> Use lighter tubes and cut them shorter. Less draw weight and more speed, it's a win-win.


Trying to get 250-275 fps with 113gr ammo with a 38 inch draw, hope I'll be able to do it.

As it stands right now 198fps and 113gr ammo gives me 9.8fpe and 22374 units of momentum ...very poor IMHO. I must improve that !

wll


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## Imperial (Feb 9, 2011)

have you looked through this thread- http://slingshotforum.com/topic/19722-speed-freaks-ssf-300-club/ they list what they set up with and videos. right now that its getting colder, you will lose some fps. rubber dont stretch and retract as well as it does during summer.


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## wll (Oct 4, 2014)

Imperial said:


> have you looked through this thread- http://slingshotforum.com/topic/19722-speed-freaks-ssf-300-club/ they list what they set up with and videos. right now that its getting colder, you will lose some fps. rubber dont stretch and retract as well as it does during summer.


Yes and it is a great thread.. I'm going out again in about 1/2 hr as I just installed longer 2050 looped tubes. The other ones were cut at 18 inches full length, these new ones I cut at 20.5 inches and i can each my 38" draw. They are very, very powerful in the pull department, and not a power set that is used to shoot cans, they are for hunting of larger game or game at longer ranges.

wll


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## oldmiser (Jan 22, 2014)

well my friend you may have too use a mega tube shooter from A+slingshots that Perry makes for your hunting quest..

just use it for a Hunting Slingshot only.....AKAOldmiser


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## Lee Silva (Feb 9, 2013)

Whats the diameter of the 113grain, Burt?


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## Charles (Aug 26, 2010)

Sorry to hear you were disappointed. In my book, shooting around 200fps with 113 gr ammo is not bad at all.

In my experience, and that of several others, you will generally get higher velocity with less draw weight using pseudo-tapered bands than using doubled bands (unless you are shooting ammo that is really too heavy for your bands). And of course you will get higher velocity with a longer draw length, all things considered.

By all means, carry on and let us know how it goes.

Cheers .... Charles


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## Wingshooter (Dec 24, 2009)

Sorry you are having such bad luck with the 1/16 kents Northener did a test with them and they come in just below the 1745 tubes. I had my crono set up so I took a set out to shoot I got 220 fps with the 3/8 and 180 with 1/2 steel for single tubes that ain't to shabby. IMHO


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## wll (Oct 4, 2014)

Wingshooter said:


> Sorry you are having such bad luck with the 1/16 kents Northener did a test with them and they come in just below the 1745 tubes. I had my crono set up so I took a set out to shoot I got 220 fps with the 3/8 and 180 with 1/2 steel for single tubes that ain't to shabby. IMHO


Yes, I never shoot 3/8, 180fps with 1/2 steel is not to bad.

I'm still on a quest !

wll


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## wll (Oct 4, 2014)

*Just Got Back from Testing Again !*

Temp 67.9 F

The looped 2050's that were cut longer and were able to stretch out to my draw length of 38' ... no improvement nothing, three shots at 199fps ;- (

I will disassemble these and make pseudo sets for Zinc China Boy

Zinc China Boy with 2050 pseudos shot 194fps ...very easy to pull back. Nice medium powerful hunting sling with this set up.

Large Kent 1/8id x 1/16w x 1/4od shot 182fps .... these are going by by, along with the smaller Kent tubes !

The 1745 looped took the prize with 208fps and was just a little harder to pull than the 2050 pseudo tubes.

So far, *FOR ME* the 1745 in looped and the 2050 in pseudo configurations are keepers. The others are gone !

I will see how the 3060, and the Kent large 1/4od thin wall.031 does. Again, not at all interested in bands as I want longevity on this set up.

I don't think I'll be able to get 250+fps at a 38" draw, but hope springs eternal, we will see.

I really want at least 10fpe at 30+ yds, that is about 200fps shooting 113gr ammo and that is about 47% the units of momentum of a 22lr at the muzzle.

wll


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## THWACK! (Nov 25, 2010)

Isn't experimenting fun? Did I tell you about my two ex-wives...


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## wll (Oct 4, 2014)

THWACK! said:


> Isn't experimenting fun? Did I tell you about my two ex-wives...


LOL, LOL, LOL :rofl:

wll


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## THWACK! (Nov 25, 2010)

wll said:


> LOL, LOL, LOL :rofl:
> 
> Isn't experimenting fun? Did I tell you about my two ex-wives...
> 
> wll


Yes, that THWACK! guy has some :screwy: sense of humor.


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## Nicholson (Sep 25, 2012)

Good to have some chrony numbers on tubes. my experience with tubes in very cold temps was an extreme lag. . I thought there was a problem with my tube bands because the person I was with that was shooting flats had no problem. Once the bands were warm again I was able to shoot but since then I never got into tubes so the testing your doing is good. I'm could be happy shooting 1/2" at 175 fps but a 100fps difference is quite a bit good luck. TWHACK, I concur lol!!!


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## wll (Oct 4, 2014)

*Went out this AM*

Not much change from yesterday, even though I shortened the tubes a bit, The Kent small tubes gave me 25fps more by drawing them about 7-8 inches longer 163fps vs 138fps ... doesn't matter much as I sold off my small and large Kent tubes yesterday.

Going back out again later with 2050 pseudos cut to 10" over all length, 2.5 inches of working loop and going to try to draw to around 48" and see what my velocity is. Is that loop long enough in you guys opinion ? Also

lengthened Zinc China Boy's pseudo 2050 to 10.5" OAL with 3" loop

I've been holding off on lengthening my draw but may need too to reach the velocity with the weight ammo I want !

I'm looking forward to doing some more testing with some new tubes I be receiving.

The mission moves on !

wll


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## wll (Oct 4, 2014)

Back Again, Second Time Today - Better ;-)

Well I lengthened my pseudos to ~10.5 inches on Zinc China Bow and the F-16, I'm pulling ~42 inches and getting an average of 220fps, a 10% increase from yesterday with 113gr leads ;- ) I did have some highs in the 240's and 235's ;- )

I'm not at 48"s of draw because I'm just afraid the tubes will break, even though they are 10.5 inches long, is 48" draw to much ???, they want to stop at that distance, should I pull through anyway .... I don't think so ;- 0

I do think that i can adjust and shoot with my draw length to 48" it is an adjustment but nor one that I can't overcome. I just hope the right size of tubes and ? gives me the speed to ammo weight ratio I want ! I'm wondering if one more inch on the single tube side will do it (no wise cracks THWACK) and should I keep the looped section at 2.5 to 3 inches ?????, that is my main question, loop section length !

I'm shooting to the right as I'm pulling off to the left a bit with my draw hand, but I can correct that. All in all I'm a bit happier seeing that I'm heading in the correct direction.

BTW: 84+gr Jaw Breakers are in at 225fps ...same hit at short range as 5/8 marbles and 0000 buck shot (buck shot has way more penetration and has way better trajectory of course because of its size to weight ratio) .... but not to bad for the Jaw Breakers for sure !

wll


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## wll (Oct 4, 2014)

Lee Silva said:


> Whats the diameter of the 113grain, Burt?


About .38, it is egg shaped, here is a pic of them in 5/8" pouches.









wll


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## Lee Silva (Feb 9, 2013)

Don't know that I could help, but wish I could... Thinkin over your situation, and I'm just not sure you'll reach goals without some compromise..... Your bar is set rather high, and although I want to see you safely over it, I think you're going to have to at least consider doing so in a more suitable pair of shoes....

Problems I see with your "Shoes".

#1 being your unwillingness to explore flats due to longevity.

If you are able to reach (think you said 300 fps?) with tubes, it's most likely going to be running them in a pseudo configuration. I doubt they'd be any better in terms of long wearing characteristic than an equal set of flats.. (Just guessing)

#2 Although you have added to your draw, I think you'll need to open-up nearly "full butterfly" or find a starship before you're through. Especially if limited to tubes.

#3 no #3 short list! hehe Got to get back in the shop! But I do have more Questions for you later... Best to you friend.... Lee


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## wll (Oct 4, 2014)

Lee Silva said:


> Don't know that I could help, but wish I could... Thinkin over your situation, and I'm just not sure you'll reach goals without some compromise..... Your bar is set rather high, and although I want to see you safely over it, I think you're going to have to at least consider doing so in a more suitable pair of shoes....
> 
> Problems I see with your "Shoes".
> 
> ...


Lee, you may very well be right in that I'm pushing what can be done and may have to be a bit more realistic. 250fps would work out OK, I would like a little more but physics is physics. I'm working on opening up my draw to ~48"

I do have Starships and I'm sure they would push up the speed considerably, but I also want a smaller profile ...there are a lot of things I want that may not be possible !

I'm about 20-30 fps off right now after today (had some above the 235 fps mark). I will take one set of 2050 looped and make them 11 inches in a pseudo configuration OAL, including a 3 inch loop. I will see if that will stretch out to a true 48' draw and see what happens. For some reason I can't get 48" out of the 10+" tubes I have set up now ..... I may just be afraid to pull back as they feel like they are bottoming out ?

wll


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## Lee Silva (Feb 9, 2013)

I need to look into finding true elongation maximum for the rubber i use as well. Not knowing has recently gotten to my head, and when shooting now i'm having to slow, and even stop a normaly "active shot" to make sure and complete my draw or I release prematurely(hehe). I have never struck myself with a band failure, but some part of my brain sees one coming for some reason and I have a he]] of a time gettin all the way opened-up!! I'm shooting at about 60% of my ability due to this hiccup!

Which reminds me!!! I wanted to ask if you shoot any differently over the clock than you do just target shooting? If you're like me, and holding back on the full "swingin" active shot, then you can count on SIGNIFICANT increase in velocity when not shooting over the chrony! The possibility of 20% or more depending on just how you go about it... Got to build a shield for mine! I'm a good shot, but when things go awry for me, they really can do some damage!


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## wll (Oct 4, 2014)

Lee Silva said:


> I need to look into finding true elongation maximum for the rubber i use as well. Not knowing has recently gotten to my head, and when shooting now i'm having to slow, and even stop a normaly "active shot" to make sure and complete my draw or I release prematurely(hehe). I have never struck myself with a band failure, but some part of my brain sees one coming for some reason and I have a he]] of a time gettin all the way opened-up!! I'm shooting at about 60% of my ability due to this hiccup!
> 
> Which reminds me!!! I wanted to ask if you shoot any differently over the clock than you do just target shooting? If you're like me, and holding back on the full "swingin" active shot, then you can count on SIGNIFICANT increase in velocity when not shooting over the chrony! The possibility of 20% or more depending on just how you go about it... Got to build a shield for mine! I'm a good shot, but when things go awry for me, they really can do some damage!


I had a few shots today that were in the 235+fps range, most of my others were in at 220fps area.

To answer your question, I make it a point to pretend I'm hunting and have the chronograph setup for a normal pull height. I pull Gangsta style and let 'er rip, trying not to hit my chrony ;- ) At the present time I'm trying to make sure I'm drawing further than I used to and get comfortable with it along with a lot of attention to my hold, turning the pouch, I look before I draw to be sure my thumb is facing me at 90 deg.

I keep telling myself to keep drawing as I'm aiming, sometimes I will stop when I get to full draw, but I let down a bit (2 to 3 inches) and then draw again, feeling that resistance I let 'er rip I shoot with the fork in my rt hand and being rt eye dominate I must make sure I'm looking over the top tube and make sure the rubber is lined up with the target, otherwise I get rights or lefts. Shot a lot of Jaw Breakers today and worked on form and lining my shot up before and while I'm drawing back. Don't get me confused with someone that is a good shot, I'm not, I just have fun, but I want controlled powerful fun. LOL, LOL, LOL. I missed a couple of shots today and had more fun thinking how close I was to them than If I would have hit them, although I would like to know what a Jaw Breaker can do at 40+ yds ;- )

I ALWAYS wear shooting glasses because if I get a snap back, I may get bruised or a bloody nose, but I won't loose an eye ....slingshots are pretty dangerous if you don't pay attention ! I also check the attachments and the band itself every few shots, just a going over, you NEVER know what the last shot did to the rubber.

I'm making a new set of 2050 pseudos tomorrow with the hope that I can draw 48" and get the velocity up and BE COMFORTABLY shooting it. Henry said I should pseudo a set of 1745's as they are powerful tubes, and yes they are, I'm impressed with them in my testing. His son put a .50 ball through a green coconut and its hull, lodging in the nut itself ... penetrating a green coconut is a major feet. ...

Anyway, later buddy, talk at ya later.

wll


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## wll (Oct 4, 2014)

*Just made up two more pseudo power sets*;

Each set is 5.5" looped and 6.5" single 12" OAL

A set of 1745 and 2050, both black ........ if I can't get 48" draw out of these I must be doing something very wrong.

I will shoot these in Dankung style slings as they as very fast to change. I'm hoping for that magical 250fps+ ;- )

wll


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## Wingshooter (Dec 24, 2009)

The simple secret to speed is stretch. You need to get up above 500% I am shooting my stuff at 600%. The main reason tapered flats are so fast is the end of the bands at the pouch are stretching to 650%. That's why they don't last very long. check this video I did comparing double 1745 tubes against single 1745 tubes. Latex will stretch to 700% before it breaks. 400 t0 500% is conservative IMHO
http://slingshotforum.com/topic/16567-comparing-double-1745-to-single-1745-video/


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## M.J (Nov 1, 2010)

Wingshooter said:


> The simple secret to speed is stretch. You need to get up above 500% I am shooting my stuff at 600%. The main reason tapered flats are so fast is the end of the bands at the pouch are stretching to 650%. That's why they don't last very long. check this video I did comparing double 1745 tubes against single 1745 tubes. Latex will stretch to 700% before it breaks. 400 t0 500% is conservative IMHOhttp://slingshotforum.com/topic/16567-comparing-double-1745-to-single-1745-video/


Exactly.
Like we discussed in PM, more stretch equals more acceleration.


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## wll (Oct 4, 2014)

Wingshooter said:


> The simple secret to speed is stretch. You need to get up above 500% I am shooting my stuff at 600%. The main reason tapered flats are so fast is the end of the bands at the pouch are stretching to 650%. That's why they don't last very long. check this video I did comparing double 1745 tubes against single 1745 tubes. Latex will stretch to 700% before it breaks. 400 t0 500% is conservative IMHO
> http://slingshotforum.com/topic/16567-comparing-double-1745-to-single-1745-video/


Thank you Roger, I can hardly wait to do more testing !

wll


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## wll (Oct 4, 2014)

*Tubes Tied for Later This Week ;- )*

Have Kent 3/16id x 1/32w x 1/4od cut to ~11.5 inches for a full 48' draw ... I tried and this will make to 48"

3060 tubes just came in and have them cut to the same length .. they resist a bit, hope to get 48" draw.

2050 tubes cut to 11.5" and hopefully a 48" draw.

1745 tubes cut to 11.5" and I think these will go to 48" draw.

All are cut pseudo style at about 1:1 ish. All testing will be done with Chinese slings except the 3060 which will launch ~113gr leads using my Stealth Fighter.

I hope I can get the kind of velocity I'm after with this longer draw.

wll


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## wll (Oct 4, 2014)

*Went out this morning !*

It was 48deg F and had a nasty cold wind to boot. Shot 113gr leads.

The 11.5" long 3060 came out at 195fps+ I still can't get 48" draw out of them, they want to "stop" ?

The 11.5" long 2050 came in a little slower at about 191fps, may not have pulled back as hard or ? ... can't get 48" draw, the tubes just seem to "stop" ?

The Kent 3/16id x 1/32w x 1/4od sent 113gr ammo out at a blistering 160fps .. Is that [email protected] or what, got about 48" draw out of them ? * I don't think these tubes are long for this world !*

Will go back out after it warms up a bit, labeled the tube sets to be sure I report things right.

I do like the 2050 and the 3060 for my usage, I like the fact that they are tough and not prone to constant breakage or need super maintenance like thin bands or thin tubes do. I can afford a *little* speed for the sake of toughness. (I said a little speed, I still want that 250ish fps)

Much more testing is needed for sure. Like I said I want to narrow my total tube sizes down to no more than three. I was getting hand slap with these, it may have been the cold or I need to increase ammo weight, or shorten the tubes and pull harder ?

wll


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