# Band Length



## The Gopher

*Band Length?*​
*What is your band length from fork to pouch?*

5 inches51.93%6 inches3915.06%7 inches7930.50%8 inches7729.73%9 inches3011.58%10 inches2911.20%


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## The Gopher

Just curious what others shoot for band length. I've been doing quite a bit of testing on rubber, and i have a hunch that a lot of people are leavign some potential band energy on the table.


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## lightgeoduck

I didn't vote yet since I use a couple of lengths, depending on my shooter, but I am curious on more info on "potential band energy on the table"

Thanks

LGD


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## Tex-Shooter

I adjust my band length for different shooting conditions, but cut too short and you leave a lot of band life on the table! -- Tex


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## The Gopher

Tex-Shooter said:


> I adjust my band length for different shooting conditions, but cut too short and you leave a lot of band life on the table! -- Tex


certainly!


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## The Gopher

Duck i just mean that i think a lot of people are shooting bands that are longer than they need to be. But i also agree 100% with Tex, that if you make them too short, not only will the bands feel funny (stack at the end of the draw) but life will be shortened.


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## e~shot

Tex-Shooter said:


> I adjust my band length for different shooting conditions, but cut too short and you leave a lot of band life on the table! -- Tex


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## Henry the Hermit

I voted 9 inches, but like Tex and others, the actual length varies. For instance, when a bend lets go at the pouch, I cut and retie. All of the slingshots I sell or give away are tied at 9 inches because that seems to be the best length for compromise between velocity and band life. I use Theraband Tubes on bent rods, and either Alliance Sterling #107 rubber bands or .050 food grade latex (personal use only) on board cuts and naturals.


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## bullseyeben!

As above, my band lengths vary a lot, I opted with 8" on the vote because I would think that's about my average cut... considering different thickness, and or layers of bands, but generally match bands to ammo I'm shooting...


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## smitty

I divide my draw length by four, but to be able to retie, a person could start by dividing draw length by 3.7 I guess or even 3.5 for two reties. I use a straight length of rubber, nothing fancy. With my 28 inch draw, I just go from tie to tie with seven inches and change bands when they look like they need to be changed. I don't like to keep shooting until they break.


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## keef

I've been cutting mine to 12 inches, but then again I'm shooting butterfly


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## tubeman

I voted 10" then realised it was _band _length. I just thought it was a boasting thing


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## SlingGal

I voted at 9", but were we talking about band length *before* they get attached to forks, or from pouch to where it comes over (or through) the forks? My bands vary from catty to catty,...some are at 9, some at 8 1/2, and some at 8. Also depends on if I'm using a picklefork or not. Like Henry, when a band goes out at the pouch I cut and retie.....but I've never gone under 7 inches. I've gotten a few tube sets that were 5 to 5 1/2 inches from Ebay Hong Kong dealers....a bit short for my liking, but man they are freaking fast.


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## Hrawk

My standard TBG cut is 30 x 20 x 180mm giving me an effective band length after tying of 160mm.

With an 84cm draw, this gives me approx 525% elongation. Not the longest lasting but get good performance. About 70m/s with 3/8 steel.


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## Jim Williams

My favourite cut at the moment is 28 x 18 x 165mm


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## pop shot

I cut 30/20 mm tapers at 10" for singles. 9" effective length. I pull about 48". Not standard but works for me.


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## cheese

my bands are 6 inches with 5 7/8 inch between the fork and pouch.


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## cheese

cheese said:


> my bands are 6 inches with 5 7/8 inch between the fork and pouch.


i use looped yellow thera tubes.


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## RedRubber

10.5 inches before tying....


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## Alex Jacob

Depends on the rubber. 7-7.5 inches with office bands, depending on their length, was my last set-up.

Following Henry's findings on 1842 tubing, my current arrangement is a 4:3 ratio of loop: single strand with a band length of 7 inches (down from 7.5). Next trial will be 6.5 inches finished length from fork to pouch knot divided by 1.62 to give a golden ratio of 4:2.5 inches and see how long that holds up to a draw of 33 inches.

Just had a bit of a play and measured my draw. It's now 35.5 inches so I think I'll stick with 7 inch bands for the longevity. That's 4:3 inch tapers for light ammo and 7 inch straight loops for heavier stuff.


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## pgandy

I enjoyed reading the inputs. Unfortunately people omitted the type of band and the number of plies. 
I voted 8" as that best represents my bands. My favourite power band is 4 plies of Theraband Black 29mm x 14mm x 7.75". I think after reading the above that I will add a little to that so that I can retie. Breaks have always been at the pouch. I do use other sizes in Theraband Gold, usually about 8" that will give draw weights of about 19 pounds with longer life than the Black for training. The black is 16.5#.


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## Sean

Just to help and clarify band length with a new bander, after attaching to pouch, then we measure our length,
cut, and then attach to fork yes? Thank you.

sean


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## Hrawk

I calculate my desired band length, then add 10mm each end for tying off. Be sure to include your pouch size when calculating length.


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## Vekta

I've been cutting 3/4" straight cut theraband Silver and Gold at 10.5 inches. After tying everything together and then tying to the fork I get exactly 8" from forks to pouch. I have one tapered theraband Gold band set 1 inch wide at the forks 3/4 inch wide at the pouch with the same band length after tying on. The straight cut theraband Silver is a really soft shooter. But it's fast and gentle enough to where I can use it as a training tool. I'll be using it a lot for a while.


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## bosh

I cut hunting bands DTBG ^inch pouch to fork. as I have a shooting style that needs everything in front of my face as I draw to my eye, but on the stuff I give away, I do Tubes at 7inch and variouse ebayed pilates bands double 7-9inch


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## Sean

Hrawk said:


> I calculate my desired band length, then add 10mm each end for tying off. Be sure to include your pouch size when calculating length.


Ah, I hadn't thought to calculate the pouch along with the band for length. Now I will thanks.

sean


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## cheese

Sean said:


> I calculate my desired band length, then add 10mm each end for tying off. Be sure to include your pouch size when calculating length.


Ah, I hadn't thought to calculate the pouch along with the band for length. Now I will thanks.

sean
[/quote]
never thought of that


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## Sean

Now when I measure a band I first tie the pouch to the bands, then pinch the pouch together, measure and cut my bands, keeping in
mind that extra bit that will be located below the tie on the fork. So, if I were to give someone a measure of my band
length on a a catty, it would be from the rear of the pinched pouch to the tie on the fork.


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## cvarcher

YEs theres a bit of variations on how people measure band length. As long as it works for them to find the best feel and strength it becomes relative. After shooting and testing many widths, thickness, and tapers, which play a part in decidng just what length feels good along with what draw length my arms allow and projectile weight I would work with Im settling more and more on somwhere between 6-7" for my 27" draw length.This is measured from the ties on the pouch to the slot of the fork or to the front ties of an OTT setup .For me if the pull becomes too hard then getting to a solid anchor point becomes harder and it breaks the concentration. I like throwing 3/8 steel and 7/16" steel. I just dont want to be throwing lead all around the environment and have seen what steel can do on game.


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## Henry the Hermit

I'm shooting shorter bands now than a year ago. That's due to me getting a Chrony and becoming fascinated with velocity. As Tex said, short, maximum performance bands won't last as long as longer bands, but I have a lot of rubber and it's cheap, so I go for speed.


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## pgandy

I voted 8” back in January 2011, but have since shortened to 6” and 7” depending and increasrd my draw length. I’ll go along with Henry regarding chronies. I bought a chrony and it made a world of difference. I bought it for my blowpipes but the slingshots are getting the attention. The chrony has proven to be a great aid in improving performance, with blowpipes and slingshots, as it has shown how such things as things as posture, pull lengths, and more can affect ballistics. And certainly not the least, disproving the gut feeling that I have a powerful combination due to the way a set pulls when in fact this is not necessarily true.


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## termite

I can't answer this one. Just too many variables. Not being sarcastic, just truthful.


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## NaturalFork

I always shoot OTT. But the effective length is usually around 7 inches or so ... 31 inch draw (Cheekbone anchor but I point the forks forward)


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## Ordie69

Still trying to figure out a happy medium between life and power. I shoot tubes so mostly what I've been able to find in the local stores. I just recently tried my hand at cutting my own, so we will so. For now I like the feel of the 9" tube draw.


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## ifix

15 to 28 inches depending on the energy i want out. will usually draw to either 35-36 or 59-60 inches. 4mm square cut gum rubber. 
for low energy target shooting usually 19-20 inch bands stretched to 36 inches.


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## Adirondack Kyle

You guys who havent yet, should try the hayes ttf setup, i find the aiming easier, band life better, and i never thought i would be able to shoot this accurately. So i prefer around 7 inches, gotta stretch them b*tches!!


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## Hrawk

adarondack kyle said:


> So i prefer around 7 inches!!


My ex wife was the same, but no way was I getting a reduction just for her


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## Adirondack Kyle

Ha. , how do you guys do that, highlight a paragraph, and add it to your post? I tried, maybee its cause i use the mobile version of the site.


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## Adirondack Kyle

To tell you the truth, i value everyones input in bandsets, slingshots, styles, ammo, but when i first started two months ago, i completely dissreguarded everything you gyys were saying about, ammo, bandcuts, draw weight, draw length. Now that im making my own and shooting alot, i can see how foolish not paying attention was. 
I am at a crossroads, and might be switching to tex tubing next month.


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## Hrawk

adarondack kyle said:


> How do you guys do that, highlight a paragraph, and add it to your post?


Click the quote button.


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## mopper

Numbers of different draw lengths are little use with everyone having a different draw length. "XXX% elongation" would have been more meaningful


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## mopper

mopper said:


> Numbers of different draw lengths are little use with everyone having a different draw length. "XXX% elongation" would have been more meaningful


Sorry i meant numbers of different band lengths, not draw lengths.


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## vfabrizio

it depends on my mood really if i want to shoot layed back sitting on the porch just messin around i go with a 12 in. butterfly flatband and I just plink some cans but if I'm trying to hunt, a 7 or 8 in. heavy pull tube is what i use.


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## AhnkoChee

Is not band length also determined by the shooters arm length? 8 inches to a short arm person may waste energy but to a long arm person 8 inches may reduce the life of the bands. Is there a formula to figure out rubber length according to draw length? I have a very long draw length archery wise of 32".


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## pop shot

Some people draw longer than others. I have shortish arms but my draw length is 36-38" (behind my ear) some people draw right in front of their face


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## boby

As others have suggested, using stretch factor instead of band length would give more consistent results, since people have a wide range of draw lengths. Furthermore, ANY length of bands of a given type pulled to the same stretch factor would have the same pull force, so stretch factor is more informative as well; this constancy of pull force at fixed stretch factor for a given band type is true for untapered, tapered, and even pseudotapered bands (of fixed taper ratio). ("Stretch Factor" is the total band length when pulled divided by the unstretched band length; band lengths should go to the pouch tie, not to the back of the pouch.)

I'm more familiar with tubes, like 1745 or 2040 from dankung.com. Measurements show that these have the best "stored energy in the bands per pull force" at a stretch factor of about 4.9 or 5.0. (This would be about 6% higher for Hygenic Corp. 0.030" thick sheet latex). By the time you pull a *single* tube (of type "A") to a higher stretch factor (say 5.5), you would be better off *for best speed per pull force* by either using *stiffer* (single) tubes (e.g., 1745 instead of 2040) at a stretch factor near 5.0, or using pseudotapered tubes of type "A" (with the single tube section of the pseudotaper still at a stretch factor of 5.5 for the same pull force). Note however, that pseudotapering is NOT beneficial for a single tube operated at a stretch factor of 5.0 or less.


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## trobbie66

I voted 8 for flats that I trade or sell. Personally I shoot pseudo taper 1745s at 10.5 inch. This allows for a half butterfly draw of 52 inch.


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## moongalba

Being new to this site and to Slingshot sport I am finding all of the answers interesting. I have only been using tubing since taking up the sport as I am finding it difficult to get Flat Band here in Australia. No doubt there is somewhere other than from abroad. For what it is worth I stick to around seven inches which allows me to pull back to my ear (Without taking it off on release of the pouch). It is a far cry from the bicycle inner tube of the 1930's to the technical jargon I read (But not understand) since taking up the sport. At 83 in December Sling Shots are a wonderful relaxant to this old codger.


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## JUSTJOB

Me, I have 7" from forks to pouch tie, my draw length is 28"-29", anchor behind ear (the archer in me), with 1" non tapered Thera Band Gold for general shooting, and double the bands for hunting.

There are times when I deviate some, depending on the slingshot, but around 7" is good for me whether using flat Thera Band, or Thera Band tubes.


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## Oneproudmeximan

12 inch bands 11 inch active 48 inch draw non tapered tbg


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## namazu

moongalba said:


> Being new to this site and to Slingshot sport I am finding all of the answers interesting. I have only been using tubing since taking up the sport as I am finding it difficult to get Flat Band here in Australia. No doubt there is somewhere other than from abroad. For what it is worth I stick to around seven inches which allows me to pull back to my ear (Without taking it off on release of the pouch). It is a far cry from the bicycle inner tube of the 1930's to the technical jargon I read (But not understand) since taking up the sport. At 83 in December Sling Shots are a wonderful relaxant to this old codger.


i find yoga sites have good selctions of rubber.


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## namazu

Thanks hrawk it worked.


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## namazu

I voted 10 inches . For both flat bands and dankung tubeing only looped .I just got in some tb green tubing for my hfx slingshot i have yet to figure out a lenth for this stuff. It super stretchy.


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## wll

Henry in Panama said:


> I'm shooting shorter bands now than a year ago. That's due to me getting a Chrony and becoming fascinated with velocity. As Tex said, short, maximum performance bands won't last as long as longer bands, but I have a lot of rubber and it's cheap, so I go for speed.


Henry I've got a question for you and I feel like a fool doing so !.

As a pretty smart guy I can't for the life of me figure out if I'm figuring the formula for 4:3 on band length correctly.

As an example if my active length is 9.5" do you divide 9.5 by 4 and then multiply that times 3, which give you 7.125 inches of single and 2.375 of double ?

Granted you would round off, but am I in the ball park ?

Thanks Henry ;- )

wll


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## pgandy

I see that Henry has not yet answered so for a 4:3 ratio on a 9.5" band try 5.4":4.1" sections. I think my math is correct, but did some rounding off.


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## wll

Wow, Since I last posted on this thread, my static length has changed a lot, it has gone from 9" to 7.25" That is an elongation factor of 422% in November 2014 to 524% today.

No wonder I was getting lousy speeds back then and now my slings are really sending 'em ! ...

Is my tube life shorter, ya a bit, but who cares, I just change it out every 4-500+ shots, it cost me less than a couple of bucks. If it is a sling I'm using every weekend at the end of the month I take a serious look to see if I want to change ?

wll


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## pult421

The Gopher said:


> Just curious what others shoot for band length. I've been doing quite a bit of testing on rubber, and i have a hunch that a lot of people are leavign some potential band energy on the table.


 Definitely true.. I just found the rubber I use has an elongation of 750 percent. I was cutting my bands for life and power I guess cause at 6 and a half inches for a 32inch draw I can still pull my latex bands to 36 no problem. Maybe 5inches would give me more power.. but accuracy?? Guess that comes with the strength to keep that ss steady.


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## t-bear

Different strokes for different folks' uses.


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## Winnie

13 inches

winnie


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## namazu

Earlier I voted 10in. Now I'm cutting them at 14 in before tying I'm now at 13 in to 13 1/2 .


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## Januzs

Longer bands allows for longer streching and more energy transference since there is a larger time for energy to be transfered.... thats why rifle´s bullet reach longer distances than a sae weight bullet from pistol or revolver.

Btw, longer bands are less stiffer allowing easy butterfly draw, the longer the draw the longer the projectile reaching.


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## hoggif

Hand size affects draw lenght and the lengh of rubber. My draw lenght is about 36" and I voted for 8" of rubber (a 1/2" more usually though). That is about 4.5:1 ratio of draw lenght to rubber.

If I squeeze more speed by shortening the rubber, about 1/2 to 1" shorter is possible, but it affects life time of rubber a lot and can make the force needed higher than I want. At 8 to 8.5" they last very long in my use. I'm using tubes pseudotapered. Not using butterfly style.


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## Winnie

13.5 inches (343mm) band with about 12.5 inches (317mm) from fork to pouch. Butterfly. Nothing left on table.


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## Smoketown

I use a 7 inch band length with a 36 inch draw anchored at jawbone just below my ear.

7/8" X .030" flats shooting 3/8" steel balls. Nice and comfortable.

One of these days, I'll drag out the chrony ...

Cheers,

Smoketown


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## sawtoothscream

out of curiosity, whats a good band length for someone with short arms? I received my new slingshot today and the bands feel pretty light to me. with my recurves and longbows i draw 27 inches and with these bands I have to draw to the back of my ears to feels some tension. think I need to cut them down a inch or two or go to a double set or thicker bands at least. Dang t rex arms


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## sawtoothscream

I do have a chrono so might be worth playing around with this stock band and see ho wmuch I gain/ lose by cutting it down


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## namazu

I mostly shoot at what is described as 3/4 butterfly . But lately have received a new sling with short 2040 looped on it 7 in active length and anchoring to my cheek bone . I find it very fast and accurate with 3/8 steel . Now expirimenting with a new one slightly longer . What I'm getting at is I'm now experimenting with shorter length bands . Amazed at the speed so far.


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## Smoketown

sawtoothscream said:


> out of curiosity, whats a good band length for someone with short arms? I received my new slingshot today and the bands feel pretty light to me. with my recurves and longbows i draw 27 inches and with these bands I have to draw to the back of my ears to feels some tension. think I need to cut them down a inch or two or go to a double set or thicker bands at least. Dang t rex arms


Simple-Shot has a bunch of great videos. Here's one for band length.






And one for draw length - 




See ya over on the GTA! (How many "Sawtooth Screams" can there be?) :wave:

Cheers,

Smoketown


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## sawtoothscream

Smoketown said:


> sawtoothscream said:
> 
> 
> 
> out of curiosity, whats a good band length for someone with short arms? I received my new slingshot today and the bands feel pretty light to me. with my recurves and longbows i draw 27 inches and with these bands I have to draw to the back of my ears to feels some tension. think I need to cut them down a inch or two or go to a double set or thicker bands at least. Dang t rex arms
> 
> 
> 
> Simple-Shot has a bunch of great videos. Here's one for band length.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And one for draw length -
> 
> 
> 
> 
> See ya over on the GTA! (How many "Sawtooth Screams" can there be?) :wave:
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Smoketown
Click to expand...

that would be me  Getting ready to install my marauder SSG today and maybe do some tuning.

as for the sling shot with the stock setup cut the bands to 9 " and got 154fps cut them to 8" and got 185 -190 . might go down to 7 but think Im going to need something with a little more weight to it.


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## sawtoothscream

thanks for that vid, if that guy needs 6" bands at 30" im going to have to cut them down to 2" lol. down to 6 go and will play around


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## hoggif

Lenght can vary a bit from one material to another. It is always best to error on the long side and tune it down gradually by testing it a few times. 4-5 is a great rule of thumb for a divider of draw lenght. With my older Dankung black tubes divider of 4.5 is about as far as I want to go to get a decent life and acceptable draw weight. With similar tube in tan color, a divider of about 5 is probably needed for similar draw weight. A couple tries is really worth it with a material you've not tried before!

I also keep a log book for different tubes for a reference, later on I can check on what I thought about some configuration and how I thought the draw weight is for me. There is also a difference if you go for max speed or if you want an all-day plinker. That's one reason why I love tubes, they are changed in an instant.

I have yet to chrony my tubes to see if either color is faster at optinum point, I'm expecting the shorter one to be a bit faster due to lower weight.


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## NoGuarantees

Hey, I saw no explanation on how to get ratio of different sized bands. I finally figured it out...
To get a 4:3 ratio and say I want a total length of 9.5 inches:

4x + 3x = 9.5 inches

So 7x = 9.5 inches

X = 9.5 / 7 inches

Therefore X = 1.357 inches

Now to get the ratio 4:3....

4 x 1.357 = 5.428 inches

3 x 1.357 = 4.071 inches

As a ratio: 5.428:4.071

To confirm total length, just add them..

5.428 + 4.071 = 9.499 inches.....which is not exactly 9.5 inches due to rounding

Question? Is 4:3 the optimum? Just curious...am not so studied up on band particulars...

NG


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## skropi

NoGuarantees said:


> Hey, I saw no explanation on how to get ratio of different sized bands. I finally figured it out...
> To get a 4:3 ratio and say I want a total length of 9.5 inches:
> 
> 4x + 3x = 9.5 inches
> 
> So 7x = 9.5 inches
> 
> X = 9.5 / 7 inches
> 
> Therefore X = 1.357 inches
> 
> Now to get the ratio 4:3....
> 
> 4 x 1.357 = 5.428 inches
> 
> 3 x 1.357 = 4.071 inches
> 
> As a ratio: 5.428:4.071
> 
> To confirm total length, just add them..
> 
> 5.428 + 4.071 = 9.499 inches.....which is not exactly 9.5 inches due to rounding
> 
> Question? Is 4:3 the optimum? Just curious...am not so studied up on band particulars...
> 
> NG


You got it a bit wrong. The 4/3 or 3/2 or whatever ratio, is about width, not length


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## NoGuarantees

Wow! Thanks skropi, it thought it was a pseudotaper! My bad...


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## NoGuarantees

Hey skropi, I think I might have been correct as my solution/answer is exactly the same as pgandy's in post #54 if I round to nearest tenth of an inch....calculating lengths for a pseudotaper of two different widths and targeting a 4:3 length ratio to achieve a certain length. I suppose the ratio would vary per differing composition and sizes of bands...


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## skropi

Wait, are you talking about tubes? If yes, then disregard what I said. I know that 4:3 and 3:2 are ratios we use in flat band width, as far as tubes are concerned I have no idea how they calculate the ratio of the pseudo-taper


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## Winnie

Januzs said:


> Longer bands allows for longer streching and more energy transference since there is a larger time for energy to be transfered.... thats why rifle´s bullet reach longer distances than a sae weight bullet from pistol or revolver.
> 
> Btw, longer bands are less stiffer allowing easy butterfly draw, the longer the draw the longer the projectile reaching.


Great analogy. I'll be using it. Thanks.


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## NoGuarantees

Yes skropi, I was calculating pseudotaper. Thanks for the replies...I should have referred to tubes or differing sized bands in order to make what I was doing more clear.

Band lengths for me is variable....I like to draw behind my ear when my bands are fresh and fix/shorten and eventually shoot from a chin-draw. I am still a armchair marksman for a while...sure enjoying everyone's post. Slingshots are much fun to read about but shooting them is even better. Hope everyone is planning to stay cool as we approach the stifling hot days of summer...


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## MakoPat

Thanks everyone. And I just found an old internet friend! Pgandy if you are still on here. I am so estatic to see from you.
Also I shoot 7" active flat bands with 5/8" straight cut for instinctive fast shooting.
8 1/2" x 3/4" straight cut for aiming.
I no longer hunt... I use theraband black.


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## THWACK!

[yt]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FMa4TBuvs8Y[yt]


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## Fullpower24hour

There’s a formula to work out what your band length should be. I know because I worked mine out to be 16cm and it’s perfect. I cannot remember the formula, but I got it from game keeper Jon’s you tube channel.


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## AUSSIE4

I shoot short draw and have a draw length of 72cm. I divide my draw by 5.5 so my bands are stretching to 550% elongation. I think it ends up something like 13.09cm which is just over 5.1 inches.


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## raventree78

I draw short at 90 cm and stretch 550% so I divide by 5.5 and get 16.36 cm which I round up to an even 17 cm. I use 1.5 cm to tie to the frame and to the pouch so I add 3 cm and my cut band length is 20 cm, with a finished active length of 17 cm.  I also have found that using the metric system is easier than messing around with inches ymmv


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